iginla
Chick Zamick
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Post by iginla on Oct 16, 2019 18:02:54 GMT
Just for clarity, what are Gui's duties? Besides recruiting the team and the odd interview, let's say we started the season well and no changes were necessary, what are Gui Doucet's day to day duties? He won't be working for free and the only duty I see he has he has flopped big time. I'm not seeing great value for money in his role right now. It's likely his wages came out of the playing budget... Errrr this is exactly what I was saying when he was appointed. 🤔 Probable answer is he’s watching some poor hockey at the weekend and then doing bugger all the rest of the week. Absolute waste of money the DOH.
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iginla
Chick Zamick
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Post by iginla on Oct 16, 2019 18:05:07 GMT
Just for clarity, what are Gui's duties? Besides recruiting the team and the odd interview, let's say we started the season well and no changes were necessary, what are Gui Doucet's day to day duties? He won't be working for free and the only duty I see he has he has flopped big time. I'm not seeing great value for money in his role right now. It's likely his wages came out of the playing budget... GD is responsible for all on ice recruitment, players & coaches. Mmmm.... And what does he do after 9.15am every morning then ! 🙄
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Jord v4
Ken Westman
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Post by Jord v4 on Oct 16, 2019 18:06:45 GMT
Possibly laughs his head off.... Until this afternoon anyway.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2019 18:07:03 GMT
Being absolutely honest, I don't think the Steelers have necessarily "better" forwards Jeez what planet are you on 🤦‍♂️
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Mark
Randall Weber
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Post by Mark on Oct 16, 2019 18:16:22 GMT
Bottom line for me, I don’t feel any better now than I did before this Q and A. Worse if anything.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 16, 2019 18:24:29 GMT
Just for clarity, what are Gui's duties? Besides recruiting the team and the odd interview, let's say we started the season well and no changes were necessary, what are Gui Doucet's day to day duties? He won't be working for free and the only duty I see he has he has flopped big time. I'm not seeing great value for money in his role right now. It's likely his wages came out of the playing budget... Errrr this is exactly what I was saying when he was appointed. 🤔 Probable answer is he’s watching some poor hockey at the weekend and then doing bugger all the rest of the week. Absolute waste of money the DOH. I'm inclined to agree. Jord I understand that he is in charge of recruitment, players and coaches but again apart from the recruitment side, what are his daily duties in relation to players and coaches? Seems to be a pretty cushy job. I don't even blame Doucet himself, he has no experience in a role that never existed here with a clearly less than adequate budget for a club our size. We set him and ourselves up to fail. Blame the man who hired him. I don't think a DOH was needed, just a major upgrade on Gary Moran. The position of a GM is fine for UK hockey. I'm even happy with them working with the head coach to recruit the team but somebody with some hockey experience at the very least is a must in that role. We need to find our Todd Kelman, somebody capable of listening and to bring the club and fans back together. This season is about 2/3 weeks of further poor management from being a complete write off.
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Post by wgray on Oct 16, 2019 18:38:22 GMT
Black also stated that we now have an over-sea’s analytics coach, who produces video packages and highlights specific areas of the games for Tim. Credit to the club for that. Black also said that the club are looking to introduce something to improve the atmosphere, mentioning drums and banners, so that also sounds positive.
With regards to the budgets, I’m bewildered. The question I’m asking myself is would Black lie in front of everyone? Maybe. But, and this is a big but, how does Doucet know the budget of all the other clubs? And has Black told him the true budget of last season? Doucet has to take Black’s word for it.
Black has effectively put all responsibility on Doucet’s shoulders with regards to recruitment, which is a good thing and it means we can get who we want with no interference, but I get the impression we’ve not got a lot of funds to work with, which is why we’re having to wait on signings.
It’s safe to say we’re not going to get the additional money that we need to compete, Doucet’s got his budget and that’s that from the sounds of it.
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Jord v4
Ken Westman
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Post by Jord v4 on Oct 16, 2019 18:47:24 GMT
Errrr this is exactly what I was saying when he was appointed. 🤔 Probable answer is he’s watching some poor hockey at the weekend and then doing bugger all the rest of the week. Absolute waste of money the DOH. Jord I understand that he is in charge of recruitment, players and coaches but again apart from the recruitment side, what are his daily duties in relation to players and coaches? Seems to be a pretty cushy job. Hey Stratty... Recruitment is all encompassing the initial coaches, the players & the on-going monitoring of their performances, which have been poo poo, & looking to improving when & where possible... Working throughout the season to maximise the players/coaches performance & moving players/coaches out & in where deemed necessary... & then towards the end building for the following season with extensions for certain players/coaches & further recruitment. It's the modern way in many sports.... The coach coaches, the director recruits, monitors & improves. all aspects of the playing side. So day to day right now...Working with the head coach over what is required in both their opinions & then going out & getting that requirement. That's any 'Director of' role in any sport really. Continuous improvement in the on ice/field product. So to admit to appointing someone with no experience & then blame them completely in an interview is an 'interesting' tactic to say the least.
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Jord v4
Ken Westman
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Post by Jord v4 on Oct 16, 2019 18:52:43 GMT
Black also stated that we now have an over-sea’s analytics coach, who produces video packages and highlights specific areas of the games for Tim. Credit to the club for that. Black also said that the club are looking to introduce something to improve the atmosphere, mentioning drums and banners, so that also sounds positive. With regards to the budgets, I’m bewildered. The question I’m asking myself is would Black lie in front of everyone? Maybe. But, and this is a big but, how does Doucet know the budget of all the other clubs? And has Black told him the true budget of last season? Doucet has to take Black’s word for it. Black has effectively put all responsibility on Doucet’s shoulders with regards to recruitment, which is a good thing and it means we can get who we want with no interference, but I get the impression we’ve not got a lot of funds to work with, which is why we’re having to wait on signings. It’s safe to say we’re not going to get the additional money that we need to compete, Doucet’s got his budget and that’s that from the sounds of it. As I said about two weeks ago regarding the budget the initial money has been spent & monies are there for exceptional circumstances. So with a player gassed the pool is that money only to replace. Now if some serious long term injuries hit or we are a complete & utter failure as opposed to the current complete failure then maybe the exceptional circumstances will be met. & to add to the budget... THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO WAY ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH WE ARE ON SIMILAR BUDGETS TO CARDIFF, SHEFF OR BELFAST. That statement is total balderdash of the highest degree. The nerve to actually state it is almost admirable.... until you remember who said it & the total contempt that person has for Panthers fans.
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Jord v4
Ken Westman
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Post by Jord v4 on Oct 16, 2019 19:13:30 GMT
Listening back to the interview & from what I know of NB's general interest in the actual results side I'd say the attitude here is pretty consistent as to the past pitiful attempts at fan connection.... There's little to no actual interest at all & any difficult question was met with the same 'not my problem'
Going back to CN a little he was responsible for all aspects of the ice product... So to appoint a DOH is indeed an attempt to modernise the system, I'd agree with that definitely.
However to admit to appointing someone with no real experience & then seeming to blame them entirely, even if it is their job, can't exactly be brilliant for morale can it?!
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Post by bobness on Oct 16, 2019 19:20:10 GMT
Jeez what planet are you on 🤦‍♂️ I'm on a planet where quotes are taken as a whole and in context before half a quote is taken and is attempted to be ridiculed by what appears to be someone with the attitude of a pre-teen schoolboy. The full quote is "Being absolutely honest, I don't think the Steelers have necessarily "better" forwards on paper than Panthers." Clearly, on ice, at this moment, Steelers' forwards are performing somewhat better than Panthers, to say the least, but the "best" Steelers' forward on paper (see quote above if you can't remember that far back) doesn't really compete with Rheault and Bulmer's CVs, for example (NHL games, multiple full seasons of AHL, DEL, Liiga etc). Davies is the pick of their bunch, with 4 seasons of DEL following the AHL, but it's slim pickings after that, and he's not their best forward by a long way at the moment. Steelers don't have a single game of SHL, Liiga or NHL in their entire forward line (I don't think, happy to be corrected). Vallerand, who is rocking along at 2 points a game, has essentially never played much above ECHL level. Ditto Connolly, and Armstrong split his NA time between ECHL and AHL about 50/50. CV wise, as said, Rheault, Bulmer and Herr are miles in front of those 3, league quality wise. But 2 of those 3 are not playing anything like it. And you can't blame quiz nights just yet, because there hasn't been one yet, has there? No issue with you disagreeing with me at all, and happy to debate it, but please don't manufacture quotes out of context, just to try and get a cheap laugh/point.
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Post by spik on Oct 16, 2019 19:25:58 GMT
Well, this avoided (replaced) the Q and A night then. Now back to a dire season.
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Yotes
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Post by Yotes on Oct 16, 2019 19:42:44 GMT
What I've taken from it is that we've employed a DoH ( Divert outrage Here ) to lead our recruitment for the next few years who Black says "has no recruitment network and will have to build one " Chris Ellis cut my question where I was wondering just how far and wide did we cast our net for the role . Seems to me we set Gui up to fail this season at least. Exactly. You hire a guy with no experience to do the most important job at the club (in terms of the bit we care about, he has an old family friend for the bit he cares about), and then stick the blame on him for not doing it very well. Also just musing as to how things would be if the 25% of revenue we pay over to the various owners of the arena over the last 21 years had gone on buying a plot of land and building a 5500/6000 seater arena ? Doubt it is financially viable but as someone who feels that the Motorpoint treats us like second class citizens can live in hope :-) We wouldn't have had that revenue without the NIC. Black often gets lauded for saving us and all that, and maybe he did, but the NIC really made the Panthers what they are today. Black was in the right place at the right time to cash in. I'll believe this about drums and flags when I see it, when it doesn't lead to a rate hike for the seats in that section and when it lasts more than 5 minutes. The ghost of Panthers Wireless looms large.
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Yotes
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Post by Yotes on Oct 16, 2019 19:52:12 GMT
It was. I'm actually amazed. Old family friend though, lol. Lol Isn’t there more than one “family friend” listed as being based in Bermuda ? 🤣 Yeah, maybe they were all old pals? Just to add on this front though, the old family friends own just as much of the Nottingham Panthers as he does (which has not always been the case, he used to be in the majority). What do they class as a success for the club?
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Post by wolfmac on Oct 16, 2019 20:03:10 GMT
Jeez what planet are you on 🤦‍♂️ I'm on a planet where quotes are taken as a whole and in context before half a quote is taken and is attempted to be ridiculed by what appears to be someone with the attitude of a pre-teen schoolboy. The full quote is "Being absolutely honest, I don't think the Steelers have necessarily "better" forwards on paper than Panthers." Clearly, on ice, at this moment, Steelers' forwards are performing somewhat better than Panthers, to say the least, but the "best" Steelers' forward on paper (see quote above if you can't remember that far back) doesn't really compete with Rheault and Bulmer's CVs, for example (NHL games, multiple full seasons of AHL, DEL, Liiga etc). Davies is the pick of their bunch, with 4 seasons of DEL following the AHL, but it's slim pickings after that, and he's not their best forward by a long way at the moment. Steelers don't have a single game of SHL, Liiga or NHL in their entire forward line (I don't think, happy to be corrected). Vallerand, who is rocking along at 2 points a game, has essentially never played much above ECHL level. Ditto Connolly, and Armstrong split his NA time between ECHL and AHL about 50/50. CV wise, as said, Rheault, Bulmer and Herr are miles in front of those 3, league quality wise. But 2 of those 3 are not playing anything like it. And you can't blame quiz nights just yet, because there hasn't been one yet, has there? No issue with you disagreeing with me at all, and happy to debate it, but please don't manufacture quotes out of context, just to try and get a cheap laugh/point. I feel there’s been a near-universal consensus since before a puck was dropped that Steelers looked more impressive in almost every position.
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BigLad
David Clarke
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Post by BigLad on Oct 16, 2019 20:15:20 GMT
NB also confirmed we wouldn't be hosting the Conti Cup final if we qualify as the area is already booked.
Also extremely disappointed with the fixture list this season.
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,440
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Post by iginla on Oct 16, 2019 20:21:23 GMT
Errrr this is exactly what I was saying when he was appointed. 🤔 Probable answer is he’s watching some poor hockey at the weekend and then doing bugger all the rest of the week. Absolute waste of money the DOH. I'm inclined to agree. Jord I understand that he is in charge of recruitment, players and coaches but again apart from the recruitment side, what are his daily duties in relation to players and coaches? Seems to be a pretty cushy job. I don't even blame Doucet himself, he has no experience in a role that never existed here with a clearly less than adequate budget for a club our size. We set him and ourselves up to fail. Blame the man who hired him. I don't think a DOH was needed, just a major upgrade on Gary Moran. The position of a GM is fine for UK hockey. I'm even happy with them working with the head coach to recruit the team but somebody with some hockey experience at the very least is a must in that role. We need to find our Todd Kelman, somebody capable of listening and to bring the club and fans back together. This season is about 2/3 weeks of further poor management from being a complete write off. Spot on. What was needed was to get rid of Moran then bring in an experienced hockey man in the dual role of GM/DOH. Because all we’re doing now is paying two salaries for one job and it would appear it’s probably impacted on the player budget.
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Post by wolfmac on Oct 16, 2019 20:26:51 GMT
I'm inclined to agree. Jord I understand that he is in charge of recruitment, players and coaches but again apart from the recruitment side, what are his daily duties in relation to players and coaches? Seems to be a pretty cushy job. I don't even blame Doucet himself, he has no experience in a role that never existed here with a clearly less than adequate budget for a club our size. We set him and ourselves up to fail. Blame the man who hired him. I don't think a DOH was needed, just a major upgrade on Gary Moran. The position of a GM is fine for UK hockey. I'm even happy with them working with the head coach to recruit the team but somebody with some hockey experience at the very least is a must in that role. We need to find our Todd Kelman, somebody capable of listening and to bring the club and fans back together. This season is about 2/3 weeks of further poor management from being a complete write off. Spot on. What was needed was to get rid of Moran then bring in an experienced hockey man in the dual role of GM/DOH. Because all we’re doing now is paying two salaries for one job and it would appear it’s probably impacted on the player budget. Oh yeah - every second question in the FB comments were some variant of “what does Gary Moran do?”/”Why is he still here?” and you could tell that Ellis was evading any line of questioning that could even lead to his name coming up.
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,440
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Post by iginla on Oct 16, 2019 20:34:10 GMT
Listening back to the interview & from what I know of NB's general interest in the actual results side I'd say the attitude here is pretty consistent as to the past pitiful attempts at fan connection.... There's little to no actual interest at all & any difficult question was met with the same 'not my problem' Going back to CN a little he was responsible for all aspects of the ice product... So to appoint a DOH is indeed an attempt to modernise the system, I'd agree with that definitely. However to admit to appointing someone with no real experience & then seeming to blame them entirely, even if it is their job, can't exactly be brilliant for morale can it?! Chris should have responded with.....what exactly was it about Gui Doucet that convinced you he was good DOH material ? Because as i see it,he’s young,got no coaching or recruiting experience and by the sound of it doesn’t have many contacts either. All i see is a desperation measure because nobody else wanted the job. Panthers would always have you believe they have stacks of applicants for coaches/player jobs,however I’ve heard it over the years from numerous different people both in and around the club that their poor reputation precedes them,they really struggle to recruit and that’s why we end up with poor quality and value for money.
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grrm
Pat Casey
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Post by grrm on Oct 16, 2019 20:35:33 GMT
Got to say I was very disappointed in Ellis. He simply didn’t ask any tough questions and certainly didn’t push NB with any good follow up questions when NB brushed the initial question aside.
All NB did was to reinforce the widely held opinion that he has little interest in actually driving the club forward himself, rather just let things ride by blaming others and pocket his money.
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iginla
Chick Zamick
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Post by iginla on Oct 16, 2019 20:39:46 GMT
Lol Isn’t there more than one “family friend” listed as being based in Bermuda ? 🤣 Yeah, maybe they were all old pals? Just to add on this front though, the old family friends own just as much of the Nottingham Panthers as he does (which has not always been the case, he used to be in the majority). What do they class as a success for the club? Yes i picked that up too Yotes. Black stated the one family friend who had a stake and that shares or something hadn’t changed for 22 years....is that true,I can’t remember where we looked at it before on companies house stuff ?
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iginla
Chick Zamick
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Post by iginla on Oct 16, 2019 20:41:31 GMT
NB also confirmed we wouldn't be hosting the Conti Cup final if we qualify as the area is already booked. Also extremely disappointed with the fixture list this season. We’ve been here before too....even that’s bloody Groundhog Day again. 🙄
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iginla
Chick Zamick
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Post by iginla on Oct 16, 2019 20:45:57 GMT
Spot on. What was needed was to get rid of Moran then bring in an experienced hockey man in the dual role of GM/DOH. Because all we’re doing now is paying two salaries for one job and it would appear it’s probably impacted on the player budget. Oh yeah - every second question in the FB comments were some variant of “what does Gary Moran do?”/”Why is he still here?” and you could tell that Ellis was evading any line of questioning that could even lead to his name coming up. Moran’s not even here at the moment,he’s swizzled off on his hols. His day generally consists of loafing around and his favourite line is usually “I’m going out,if Neil rings tell him I’m at the printers” !
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Post by John Casey on Oct 16, 2019 20:47:25 GMT
NB also confirmed we wouldn't be hosting the Conti Cup final if we qualify as the area is already booked. Also extremely disappointed with the fixture list this season. We’ve been here before too....even that’s bloody Groundhog Day again. 🙄 What's on instead, don't tell me it's cheerleaders or speed skating
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,440
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Post by iginla on Oct 16, 2019 20:50:05 GMT
Got to say I was very disappointed in Ellis. He simply didn’t ask any tough questions and certainly didn’t push NB with any good follow up questions when NB brushed the initial question aside. All NB did was to reinforce the widely held opinion that he has little interest in actually driving the club forward himself, rather just let things ride by blaming others and pocket his money. True. Much as i like Chris and he’s the best interviewer we’ve got by a mile,I’m afraid the tough questions were bottled out of.
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