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Post by pantherdman on Sept 14, 2011 20:12:18 GMT
If both teams had enforcers they could have settled it like men instead of cowards and no one would have been seriously injured.
Sorry, the Elite league has forced all tough guys out of the league and opted for Euro style, this is what you get, knees/ slashes and serious injuries. reap what you sow. enjoy!
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Post by Thomas Elliott on Sept 14, 2011 20:14:42 GMT
I seem to remember Sheffield fans being up in arms when Voth slashed Dagenais to the back of the legs!! Voth got 12 games, 6 for the slash and 6 for the suckerpunch and I believe that the sheffield Star were running different stories throughout the week with a different Steelers player/management member saying how Dagenais was lucky he was still alive!!
I've not seen the slash so don't know how bad it was, but my point is this, slashing can be just as dangerous as leaving a knee out. The hit could have been a knee jerk reaction, see what I did there, and a case of trying to turn back towards the player as he skates past him. To get up and two hand him back is a deliberate act to hurt, and nothing else. Like I say I've not seen it, so can't comment on the extent, just delving into what might have happened and thus why you might be disappointed with the disciplinary decision.
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Post by Thomas Elliott on Sept 14, 2011 20:16:19 GMT
If both teams had enforcers they could have settled it like men instead of cowards and no one would have been seriously injured. Sorry, the Elite league has forced all tough guys out of the league and opted for Euro style, this is what you get, knees/ slashes and serious injuries. reap what you sow. enjoy! Agree with that, many wouldn't and will pick out the usual bits about enforcers not offering anything other than panto fights, and people were still getting injured when they were here, but I agree with that statement.
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Post by Swamp Donkey on Sept 14, 2011 21:06:07 GMT
I seem to remember Sheffield fans being up in arms when Voth slashed Dagenais to the back of the legs!! Voth got 12 games, 6 for the slash and 6 for the suckerpunch and I believe that the sheffield Star were running different stories throughout the week with a different Steelers player/management member saying how Dagenais was lucky he was still alive!! I remember this - I heard it was retaliation one of Randy Dangerknees many kneeing penalties, this one on a Cardiff player........
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Post by andyh91 on Sept 14, 2011 21:21:17 GMT
Agreed, it must have a been helluvva slash to get penalised like that... butwithout seeing it, depends on the intent of the slash, was it high? was it a 2 handed golf swing? DIfficult without seeing the knee as well. Had they had words earlier? was it in response to another incident? JUst curious. FWIW im all for players giving out a good slash when stuff like that happens, keeps it honest. honestly cant say if they had words or it was for a previous incident but ant remember anything happening to give zarb a reason to do what he did, and the slash i think anyone would have done it and it was low the slash and two handed i think, a 2+2 tops, but it still makes me wonder why carson called the slash even though he witnessed why jono slashed him. zarb did go out of his way to get jono he must have they wernt actually that close to the play or that close to each other and it could have been avoided. maybe the fight was the end of it maybe it isnt who knows, all i think is that zarb is pretty lucky to get the same as what phillips did
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seedy
Pat Casey
Posts: 330
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Post by seedy on Sept 14, 2011 21:26:55 GMT
If both teams had enforcers they could have settled it like men instead of cowards and no one would have been seriously injured. Sorry, the Elite league has forced all tough guys out of the league and opted for Euro style, this is what you get, knees/ slashes and serious injuries. reap what you sow. enjoy! enforcers arent the way forward. Old time hockey is the way forward. To steal a theory (ill give credit if he asks me to!): Zarb hits Phillips, in whatever context, Phillips stands up, slashes Zarb, both get their licks in, you, results and consequences not withstanding, its all over and done with. The players have resolved it, old time hockey. Now you add 2 enforcers, one on each team, zarb hits phillips, phillips gets up, does nothing, steelers enforcer goes out next shift and offers zarb, zarb says no way, so its up to Dundees(?) tough guy, you end up with 2 guys completely uninvolved with the original incident in a nothing fights minutes later, most likely neither guys really wants it, they dont care, just doing their job so probably wont be giving 100% If the enforcer decides to jump Zarb then you have the same situation just with an extra few steps, an extra delay. Ideally, if Phillips felt so strongly about the knee, or Zarb about the slash, they would have dropped the gloves there and then, thats how the best fights happen.
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Post by andyh91 on Sept 14, 2011 21:28:00 GMT
I seem to remember Sheffield fans being up in arms when Voth slashed Dagenais to the back of the legs!! Voth got 12 games, 6 for the slash and 6 for the suckerpunch and I believe that the sheffield Star were running different stories throughout the week with a different Steelers player/management member saying how Dagenais was lucky he was still alive!! I've not seen the slash so don't know how bad it was, but my point is this, slashing can be just as dangerous as leaving a knee out. The hit could have been a knee jerk reaction, see what I did there, and a case of trying to turn back towards the player as he skates past him. To get up and two hand him back is a deliberate act to hurt, and nothing else. Like I say I've not seen it, so can't comment on the extent, just delving into what might have happened and thus why you might be disappointed with the disciplinary decision. dont think jono and voth can be compared really jono aint the type to go out of his way to injury someone, i see your point though but zarb didnt just leave his knee out that sort of hit is banned i think, and the slash was one that said at the end of it you tawt what was that for, he aimed for him centre ice so i doubt it was a knee jerk lol, and as for the voth thing he wasnt retaliating for anything and slashing goes on all the time when players dont like certain things they recieve you watch your next game most players will hit back after a hit or something, wont be the one like jono's but hopefully u get my point ha
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Post by andyh91 on Sept 14, 2011 21:29:55 GMT
If both teams had enforcers they could have settled it like men instead of cowards and no one would have been seriously injured. Sorry, the Elite league has forced all tough guys out of the league and opted for Euro style, this is what you get, knees/ slashes and serious injuries. reap what you sow. enjoy! what are you on about lol? i agree about the cowards part on zarb but not jono he can haredly step up to zarb when he could hardly get off ice
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seedy
Pat Casey
Posts: 330
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Post by seedy on Sept 14, 2011 21:36:26 GMT
dont think jono and voth can be compared really jono aint the type to go out of his way to injury someone, Im picking just this line here, players should be penalised based on the rules, not the 'type of player' they are. If the incident is comparable then there should be a comparable ban. Voth gets victimised by refs because they percieve him as 'they type of player'. I dont think the slash andy referred to by voth was worth anywhere near 6 games. Yea it was a cheap shot but it wasnt ever gonna end his career. The sucker punch, different kettle of fish... THe league has rules to stop players who take too many majors, to quopte the disciplinary summary 'Once a player reaches six 10-minute penalties or six game misconducts, a fine and a ban will be issued'
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warx
Robert Lachowicz
"Fear the Beard"
Posts: 521
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Post by warx on Sept 14, 2011 23:02:38 GMT
If both teams had enforcers they could have settled it like men instead of cowards and no one would have been seriously injured. Sorry, the Elite league has forced all tough guys out of the league and opted for Euro style, this is what you get, knees/ slashes and serious injuries. reap what you sow. enjoy! Because Hunter didn't cheapshot Turgeon after he scored and McSorely didn't hit Brashear in the head with his stick now did he. Cheapshots will happen whether there be tough guys or not, but if there's tough guys, then someone's getting jumped afterwards.
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Post by andyh91 on Sept 14, 2011 23:41:46 GMT
dont think jono and voth can be compared really jono aint the type to go out of his way to injury someone, Im picking just this line here, players should be penalised based on the rules, not the 'type of player' they are. If the incident is comparable then there should be a comparable ban. Voth gets victimised by refs because they percieve him as 'they type of player'. I dont think the slash andy referred to by voth was worth anywhere near 6 games. Yea it was a cheap shot but it wasnt ever gonna end his career. The sucker punch, different kettle of fish... THe league has rules to stop players who take too many majors, to quopte the disciplinary summary 'Once a player reaches six 10-minute penalties or six game misconducts, a fine and a ban will be issued' have to agree tbh, but the sense i ment it in was that voth on shifts goes out to injure certain players jono didn't or doesnt
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seedy
Pat Casey
Posts: 330
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Post by seedy on Sept 15, 2011 6:12:50 GMT
Voth goes out to injure people? Give it a rest! He's an old-time player that people don't know how to handle because of his size.
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Doom
Greg Hadden
Posts: 1,591
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Post by Doom on Sept 15, 2011 6:40:53 GMT
When the incident happened Saturday night my initial reaction was to be furious with Jono, because I didn't see the kneeing.
After finding out what happened I can understand now why he did slash Zarb.
I believe Jono had had a fairly injury free career until last season when he had his freak accident colliding with the net and bending his leg back in the wrong direction, causing his knee ligaments damage.
I guess when you've spent 3 months trying to get fit and then someone takes you out at the same knee and you feel it pop again you're going to show your frustration. There was no point in Jono trying to fight Zarb, because there would only be one winner and he'd be likely to do even more damage to the knee.
Unfortunately these things happen with professional sports people. I doubt very much that Zarb did it deliberately knowing Phillips history with that knee, I guess he was just showing his frustration with how the game was going.....These things happen in sport.
Hopefully there won't be too many long term injuries for any of the teams, because full strength squads provide a better entertainment spectacle.
Regards
Doom
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Post by Heanor Lair on Sept 15, 2011 7:30:18 GMT
Doom has a point - Im concerned when Meyers comes back his shoulder will be targetted.
HL
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Shorty
Paul Adey
Still here for Private Messages
Posts: 6,636
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Post by Shorty on Sept 15, 2011 7:35:14 GMT
the slash i think anyone would have done it and it was low the slash and two handed i think, a 2+2 tops, but it still makes me wonder why carson called the slash even though he witnessed why jono slashed him. Are you really suggesting that a ref should not call a penalty if it is something that has been done in retaliation? ?
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Post by crazykeeper on Sept 15, 2011 7:35:53 GMT
Doom has a point - Im concerned when Meyers comes back his shoulder will be targetted. HL And that's why the NHL teams only release details such as "upper body injury"
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Shorty
Paul Adey
Still here for Private Messages
Posts: 6,636
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Post by Shorty on Sept 15, 2011 7:38:51 GMT
Zarb stuck out the knee of Jono, who went down, picked himself up and gave Zarb a whack ( luckily it wasn't that hard or Zarb would be injured as well), At last, a very good point.
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Post by texpef on Sept 15, 2011 7:39:32 GMT
AS stated we havent seen much sympathy (and still dont) for Meyers and importantly we still havent a date as to when he will return. Philips being injured for sheffield helps our cause so all to the good, with any luck he could be out for the season. Dont want to wish injury on any player (well apart from finnerty who i hope Zarb cripples ) but this is nothing to do with panthers, philips doesnt play for us and we didnt do this so other than steelers are a weaker team now i couldnt personally care less....
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Doughnut
Forum Admin
mmmmmm ... Doughnuts
Posts: 5,072
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Post by Doughnut on Sept 15, 2011 9:11:41 GMT
If both teams had enforcers they could have settled it like men instead of cowards and no one would have been seriously injured. That's just not true. The knee injury was the first thing that happened. What difference does it make if it's subsequently "settled" by enforcers or by the ref or not at all? Sorry, the Elite league has forced all tough guys out of the league and opted for Euro style, this is what you get, knees/ slashes and serious injuries. reap what you sow. enjoy! I'm not saying that enforcers don't have their place, but I have serious doubts over their ability to reduce, let alone put an end to dirty play and injuries. There was plenty dirty play and injuries when there were more enforcers in the league, most of which actually perpetrated by the enforcers. It's a total myth that enforcers lead to clean play and fewer injuries. Is the LNAH squeaky clean and injury free? Nope.
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DS
Lorne Smith
Posts: 723
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Post by DS on Sept 15, 2011 9:39:35 GMT
Agreed, it must have a been helluvva slash to get penalised like that... butwithout seeing it, depends on the intent of the slash, was it high? was it a 2 handed golf swing? DIfficult without seeing the knee as well. Had they had words earlier? was it in response to another incident? JUst curious. FWIW im all for players giving out a good slash when stuff like that happens, keeps it honest. honestly cant say if they had words or it was for a previous incident but ant remember anything happening to give zarb a reason to do what he did, and the slash i think anyone would have done it and it was low the slash and two handed i think, a 2+2 tops, but it still makes me wonder why carson called the slash even though he witnessed why jono slashed him. zarb did go out of his way to get jono he must have they wernt actually that close to the play or that close to each other and it could have been avoided. maybe the fight was the end of it maybe it isnt who knows, all i think is that zarb is pretty lucky to get the same as what phillips did Phillips deserved the 5+Game for the slash!! was 2 handed
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d
Jade Galbraith
Posts: 123
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Post by d on Sept 15, 2011 11:41:36 GMT
Personally I think the slash deserved a 2+10. Not that it matters that he got a game misconduct. Not like he was going to be finishing the game anyway. My view on the slash was that it was 2 handed but it only got the skate/skate blade, it was very low and seemed to be to make a point that he wasnt happy about the hit and was mouthing at him while doing so. It wasnt a wild hit to take Zarb down. I have seen much worse. Dont think I have seen anyone call for Zarb to be suspended which is good. Stephenson stepped in and fought him and overall he probably won the fight. The matter was settled on the ice IMO. If King and Co want to have a word next time we play Dundee I am all for that. Spice it up a bit I feel for Jono, especially after it happening twice in 12 months but these things happen in sports.
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Post by andyh91 on Sept 15, 2011 20:56:31 GMT
Voth goes out to injure people? Give it a rest! He's an old-time player that people don't know how to handle because of his size. erm no why would i give it a rest, he deserves his ass handing to him and im happy he has decided to give it another year before he retires cos hes someone that doesnt deserve to be able to call time on his own career, and tbh when did he last have a toe to toe fight? for example lepine tried it on with him last week and he pussied out of it, but ill not get into why i hate voth, and no its not cos im a steeler or dont like taking what we give out etc etc, quite happy for us to take what we give out as everyone else should, but get back to the two players involved zarb and jono, every situation is different, and no not because again we are steelers etc but just because its a new season new players and zarb has no reason to have a feud wi us, which with his actions towards jono whould suggest that he has one
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Post by andyh91 on Sept 15, 2011 21:04:34 GMT
yeah true doom but again the more and more i think about it as it was right in front of were i sit, 118 row b, the play went towards the home pen box, and jono was skating through the centre, and zarb took a look at him and took him out with knee, now i get maybe he was frustrated but now they is hardly any doubt left that zarb did target jono, maybe.
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Post by andyh91 on Sept 15, 2011 21:09:24 GMT
the slash i think anyone would have done it and it was low the slash and two handed i think, a 2+2 tops, but it still makes me wonder why carson called the slash even though he witnessed why jono slashed him. Are you really suggesting that a ref should not call a penalty if it is something that has been done in retaliation? ? no what i meant was that jono didnt deserve the same punishment as zarb as ther different incidents, not that he shouldnt get a pen as he defo should have but not the same as zarb was my point
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Post by andyh91 on Sept 15, 2011 21:12:56 GMT
AS stated we havent seen much sympathy (and still dont) for Meyers and importantly we still havent a date as to when he will return. Philips being injured for sheffield helps our cause so all to the good, with any luck he could be out for the season. Dont want to wish injury on any player (well apart from finnerty who i hope Zarb cripples ) but this is nothing to do with panthers, philips doesnt play for us and we didnt do this so other than steelers are a weaker team now i couldnt personally care less.... nicly said not lol talk about being hockey fans, tbh i hate every think about panthers ill admit that no sucking up from me but with meyers i didnt like the fact he would miss the start of season i rate him as a player and really hoped for when we do finally meet that we are both at full strenth, so ther will be no complaining from either sets of fans yes that means you aswel, about being short handed etc unfortunatly that wont sort out carson when he refs lol
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