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Post by Spooks on Jan 12, 2010 14:17:47 GMT
We were banned from taking an umbrella into the NIC? I wasn't going to put it up inside, thats bad luck LOL. WTF, It was the exhibition game against Geneva. . just so you know, thats a health and safety thing. the umbrella would be left on the floor and so could cause a trip hazard..... i asked the question when they took my wifes off her. Ahh and the plastic beer pints and spilt ale isnt ? The NIC and its policies is a shambles.
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richo
Jade Galbraith
Posts: 26
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Post by richo on Jan 12, 2010 15:05:35 GMT
I think some of fans on this forum the disillusioned ones if you feel you that way don't come and that is the reason way we not have won the title since 1956.
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lee
David Clarke
Posts: 3,712
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Post by lee on Jan 12, 2010 15:11:13 GMT
I think some of fans on this forum the disillusioned ones if you feel you that way don't come and that is the reason way we not have won the title since 1956. if i have translated your comment correctly. NO NO NO NO NO the reason we haven't won a title since 1956 is because the panthers have not won enough games in a season. FACT!
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Post by NickThePanther44 on Jan 12, 2010 15:28:32 GMT
I think I'd put myself in the camp of disillusioned. Looking back I realise I was never going to keep the same amount of enthusiasm I had when I first started going to games but I think it's gone beyond that now. I work shifts and my girlfriend is at uni at Warwick, both circumstances mean I miss a few games here and there, what worries me is I'm really not bothered. There was a time I'd walk out the NIC after a game and couldn't wait to get back there for another one, waiting for buses in the rain, snow or wind didn't deter me in the slightest. I now find myself going mainly out of habit, seeing friends and the hope of an entertaining game. I'm not sure what bracket of fan I'm in, a Panthers fan or just a hockey fan, I say this because seeing Panthers win isn't enough anymore if the hockey is boring. I know the reason I'm losing interest is simply because I'm not being as entertained anymore.
Last Saturday at times we played in your face, aggressive hockey and I thats the hockey I love, that for me is what sets hockey apart, the aggression, passion and players willing to fight for there team and fans. I have only ever felt less interested in Panthers once before, the 05/06 season with Blaisdell in charge. It might sound stupid for some but if Panthers dont have an enforcer then I think that really effects the entertainment level and I'd guess that's a major reason why I'm slowly getting more and more bored at games. I love hard hitting, aggressive hockey and you just don't get that often enough without an enforcer on the books.
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Post by texpef on Jan 12, 2010 15:31:37 GMT
Come on Bramley if next season we had the equivalent of Clark, Wood, Nieckar and allison in the team you would be brimming, thing is that aint going to happen and we all know it... Capitals left deliberately!!!! ;D
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Post by NickThePanther44 on Jan 12, 2010 15:40:52 GMT
Come on Bramley if next season we had the equivalent of Clark, Wood, Nieckar and allison in the team you would be brimming, thing is that aint going to happen and we all know it... Capitals left deliberately!!!! ;D If we signed four heavyweights again then I'd take a tent and live at the NIC Seriously though I'd take one heavyweight, the team toughness we had with Ndur, Bergin, Richardson and Neilson seemed a good balance for this league. If we could get another Craighead for next season I'd be over the moon, tough as hell, aggressive, stuck up for the team and put up big points. Saying that I'd also be happy with another Shmyr or Ndur.
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Post by pantherinmanc on Jan 12, 2010 16:13:13 GMT
I think many people make a lot of valid points about being hockey fans or being Panthers fans. There are plenty of fans, and i'd say the vast majority of the fanbase (including a lot of ST holders, part time attendees, those that just look in the NEP for results) who are fans of the team but not massively knowledgeable about the game, other leagues, the rules etc etc - hockey is a good night out and they enjoy it. One thing that needs to be accepted by many is that there is nothing wrong with that, you don't have to sit up with matchsticks in your eyes watching NHL every night, go to every away game or lace up your own skates every week to be part of the Panthers community (careful not to use the word family there!). Arguably it is that larger group surrounding the more vociferous, more vocal group (which is heavily represented on this forum) that gives us the opportunity to watch our hockey in a nice arena, to be fans of the richest team in the country and not to be worrying about dwindling crowds, looking for a new home etc etc
The problem with following one club passionately, year in year out, is that it comes with a requirement to take the rough with the smooth - jeez i've learnt that the hard way on the banks of the Trent. So the team might not have the big tough enforcer you want this season, that's just one of those things, you can't please all of the people all of the time. It is a bigger thing than just hockey, it is a social event, maybe you like to have a few beers. the fact that these 'add ons' enhance your evening shouldn't be seen as a bad thing, or justification for the view that Panthers hockey has become boring. Personally I love going to hockey games across the world, I love seeing new rinks, having a beer with local fans, having a look around the merchandise store etc. None of that is to do with the actual game - which I enjoy as well - it's all part of the wider picture.
Fans come and go, it'll always happen, the attrition rate is supposedly quite high (this is from a hazy memory of listening to GM a while back, talking about the attrition rate of ST holders) so when we all talk about clubs increasing attendance what we fail to factor in a lot of the time is that before they can increase it they have to attract enough new fans in to replace those that fall away each year.
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Post by bill238 on Jan 12, 2010 17:01:19 GMT
I think many people make a lot of valid points about being hockey fans or being Panthers fans. There are plenty of fans, and i'd say the vast majority of the fanbase (including a lot of ST holders, part time attendees, those that just look in the NEP for results) who are fans of the team but not massively knowledgeable about the game, other leagues, the rules etc etc - hockey is a good night out and they enjoy it. One thing that needs to be accepted by many is that there is nothing wrong with that, you don't have to sit up with matchsticks in your eyes watching NHL every night, go to every away game or lace up your own skates every week to be part of the Panthers community (careful not to use the word family there!). Arguably it is that larger group surrounding the more vociferous, more vocal group (which is heavily represented on this forum) that gives us the opportunity to watch our hockey in a nice arena, to be fans of the richest team in the country and not to be worrying about dwindling crowds, looking for a new home etc etc The problem with following one club passionately, year in year out, is that it comes with a requirement to take the rough with the smooth - jeez i've learnt that the hard way on the banks of the Trent. So the team might not have the big tough enforcer you want this season, that's just one of those things, you can't please all of the people all of the time. It is a bigger thing than just hockey, it is a social event, maybe you like to have a few beers. the fact that these 'add ons' enhance your evening shouldn't be seen as a bad thing, or justification for the view that Panthers hockey has become boring. Personally I love going to hockey games across the world, I love seeing new rinks, having a beer with local fans, having a look around the merchandise store etc. None of that is to do with the actual game - which I enjoy as well - it's all part of the wider picture. Fans come and go, it'll always happen, the attrition rate is supposedly quite high (this is from a hazy memory of listening to GM a while back, talking about the attrition rate of ST holders) so when we all talk about clubs increasing attendance what we fail to factor in a lot of the time is that before they can increase it they have to attract enough new fans in to replace those that fall away each year. This is a very good post and I completely agree with it. As a newcomer to this forum I would like to say that a lot of the things written on this forum are about the old times. people need to move on. There is no point saying how good the atmosphere used to be at the barn who cares that was in the past, everyone needs to concentrate on the atmosphere we have at presesnt and everyone needs to try and help to improve it. Also I heard someone mention how all the fans used to be close to the players and how that was so much better than what the player- fan relationship is like now . Get with the times. We are a proffesional club. Do you ever see wayne rooney going and having a beer with the fans.
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Paul
Robert Lachowicz
Posts: 425
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Post by Paul on Jan 12, 2010 17:34:52 GMT
I don't want to go over ground that has already been covered as my feelings mirror many of those already on here (I also disagree with a lot but, again, that's covering old ground).
I'd just like to ask one question (maybe it needs its own thread, I don't know) what REALISTICALLY can the Panthers management do try to win over the disillusioned?
The hockey on display has an effect on the fan's mood but I think that's the one thing we can't affect. The team should be down to the coach and only the coach.
So what can be done?
For me the presentation is stale to the point of cringeworthy at times. It needs a complete overhaul from start to finish. The music needs re-thinking, the entrance, I could go on but it's everything. The management should open its eyes and realise that what they are doing is not lifting the crowd.
As for lifting the crowd why not allow those who want to sing & shout to congregate in the way they do a football. The noise generated by fans on terraces in Germany has been mentioned in this thread and that's what we should be looking towards. There wasn't a huge amount of noise coming from the rest of the seats at the games that I saw but that didn't matter because the fans that were making noise made enough for all. Apart from Sheffield games how many people sit in blocks 18 & 19? very few so have those as noise blocks. Don't sit there if you want a quiet night, congregate there if you want to sing, make it first come first served. Have a steward dispensing tickets in return for a game ticket or a season ticket. But, what of the fans who sit near there but don't want the noise? Give them an incentive to move. Knock £20, £30, £40, £50 off the price of next season's ST if they will move to somewhere quieter. After that they pay the same as everyone else.
I'm not saying these ideas will work but Panthers, give them a try. Sort out the debacle over who bans drums and instruments and give it a go. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work but is what we've got now working?
One final thought for the Panthers, don't forget who pays the bills. There was a game the other week where four or five different schools and organizations invited by the management were name checked (not that this or their presence is a bad thing - quite the contrary) but it seemed like the only people not mentioned were those who are there every week. Don't take us for granted because that's the surest way to lose people.
Right, sorry abou the rant I'd better go and catch my bus.
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Jonzee
Jade Galbraith
Serious Business
Posts: 199
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Post by Jonzee on Jan 12, 2010 17:52:26 GMT
The entrance is the only bit where everyone is on their feet clapping. Why would you want to change that?
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Yotes
Forum Admin
Posts: 16,408
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Post by Yotes on Jan 12, 2010 19:04:23 GMT
Because it could be better?
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Post by rangers on Jan 12, 2010 19:04:38 GMT
Its odd. After almost exactly 10 years watching the sport, I've never been more enthused. For the first time I've actually got involved beyond being a spectator because I enjoyed my hockey so much last season. I'm lacing up the skates next month for my second game, and potentially will take it up regularly. OK, I don't get to see 'my' team very often - I am missing my first Viper game at the NIC this weekend, for example - but I think that by not getting involved in the politics of the teams so much, and just watching the sport with no emotional attatchment has made me appreciate what a great sport this is. Having the best seat in the house to watch Pasi Raitenen in goal on Sunday was one of the best moments I've had in a hockey rink in the last 10 years. Its those moments that keep me coming, and I would not dream of missing a match (unless work gets in the way, of course)
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Post by Alf Garnett on Jan 12, 2010 19:46:42 GMT
I'd just like to ask one question (maybe it needs its own thread, I don't know) what REALISTICALLY can the Panthers management do try to win over the disillusioned? Put out a team that wins the league title.
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Ian
Matt Myers
Posts: 1,702
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Post by Ian on Jan 13, 2010 7:21:31 GMT
I think some of fans on this forum the disillusioned ones if you feel you that way don't come and that is the reason way we not have won the title since 1956. Way, way, way off the mark. If it were not for the support and loyalty of long-standing fans over many years, there would not be a Panthers to play in our shiny new arena at all. How would things be if everybody who got a bit disillusioned with something just packed up and went on their way? You need people with enough commitment and honesty to speak out when things are not right.
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Milkman™
Les Strongman
Always Delivers
Posts: 5,300
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Post by Milkman™ on Jan 13, 2010 12:38:45 GMT
I think some of fans on this forum the disillusioned ones if you feel you that way don't come and that is the reason way we not have won the title since 1956. Way, way, way off the mark. If it were not for the support and loyalty of long-standing fans over many years, there would not be a Panthers to play in our shiny new arena at all. How would things be if everybody who got a bit disillusioned with something just packed up and went on their way? You need people with enough commitment and honesty to speak out when things are not right. Not forgetting all those people behind the scenes who work for nothing too. If we are talking about becoming the 'professional outfit' or even 'team hollywood' then maybe its time to rethink the whole setup, starting at the top of course
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Post by spik on Jan 13, 2010 13:07:56 GMT
I think some of fans on this forum the disillusioned ones if you feel you that way don't come and that is the reason way we not have won the title since 1956. Way, way, way off the mark. If it were not for the support and loyalty of long-standing fans over many years, there would not be a Panthers to play in our shiny new arena at all. How would things be if everybody who got a bit disillusioned with something just packed up and went on their way? You need people with enough commitment and honesty to speak out when things are not right. Well said AND as Milkman says afterwards. There is nothing I'd like to happen than Panthers go and win this seasons league after I have stated that we won't. Nobody, I hope, will come out and slate us for saying what we think (as all again could change by next week) as I still think we can't do it. But more power to us if things do start to look a bit more rosy if Coventry lose once more. It would be exceptonal and a laugh for those holding faith that I'd be proven wrong. Bolero Square, time and place please ready for bad eggs to be thrown at us when Nottingham take the title. ;D What are the top things needed by the fans to improve on things to make us less disillusioned.Probably only a question to those feeling so.But has anyone ideas that are definately needed.
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Post by pantherinmanc on Jan 13, 2010 13:46:39 GMT
Bolero Square, time and place please ready for bad eggs to be thrown at us when Nottingham take the title. ;D What are the top things needed by the fans to improve on things to make us less disillusioned.Probably only a question to those feeling so.But has anyone ideas that are definately needed. Mick I can assure you the only thing i'll have in my hand in Bolero Square if we were to win the Championship is at least one pint glass in each hand, being continually filled with lager! What can they do to 'help' the disillusioned. I dunno. For some probably nothing, some people took a conscious decision to stop going as often, some still go but aren't happy. In expect you'll find those same types in every fanbase of every club in the country, be it hockey, rugby, footy, cricket etc. However the club could be a little more forthcoming with the fanbase and treat them with more than a broad brush of marketing razzmataz as it seems at present. Louder the roar bigger the score may work for the fringe fans but for the 'inner circle' (for want of better words) maybe a better quality media offering on the site, proper video interviews with players (christ even normalising them so that the poor quality recording with Corey rinkside at training isn't 5 times as loud as the next audio item would help), proper match reports not just an account of the order of scoring with the odd hockery buzzword thrown in by GM to make it sound knowledgeable - we never seem to get a proper match report, the likes of Manchester Phoenix seem to give a proper review of their EPL games so why can't the 'richest club in the country' manage it.
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Post by spik on Jan 13, 2010 13:58:54 GMT
One thing I'd like to see in the programme.It won't happen now I have said it,is. Have the top 18 players or so we start with mentioned as SQUAD players on any match report/stats page then all they have to do is state who did or did not play in that particular game. For example add. Molin scratch Toneys. Just one small thing before all those mentioned previous which added together can improve on things.
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Post by focus12 on Jan 13, 2010 22:02:44 GMT
Pantherinmanc, how do you think we became the richest club in the country? It wasn't by spending money on equipment to enhance the fans enjoyment. Even the DVD's that are produced are 'front room' copies done on cheap equipment.
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Milkman™
Les Strongman
Always Delivers
Posts: 5,300
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Post by Milkman™ on Jan 13, 2010 22:16:13 GMT
Even the DVD's that are produced are 'front room' copies done on cheap equipment. Are they paying Steve yet?
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Post by pantherinmanc on Jan 14, 2010 9:03:08 GMT
I appreciate the need to be frugal, AuntieB, however how much does a spellchecker cost? How much do you think Andy Costigan gets paid to write a full match report on Phoenix games, proper in depth analysis on the full 3 periods? And he works all week in a full time job but still finds the time. How much does it cost to offer one, or both, of the universities (of which we have two, very well thought of and attended institutions) the opportunity for their media students to get involved in producing some promo vids, pre/post match video interviews, hell they might even know how to upload two sound clips that aren't 20 decibels different every time.
I appreciate that we are not the Toronto Maple Leafs but while this club, or at least the lts company that is 'the club' can afford to pay Neil Blacks 'Aladdin Management' a 6 figure sum every year as an 'operating fee' then I feel the fans are being shortchanged. I also don't buy GMs 'i'm rushed off my feet' excuses. He may well be, but work smarter, not harder, there is no excuse for some of the unprofessional shoddy output that comes from the club, it's just lack of pride and, dare I say it, quit possibly lack of ability.
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Post by Samxpenguin on Jan 14, 2010 12:25:02 GMT
It's interesting the amount of people who feel disillusioned at the moment. I havn't been going to Panthers regularly for about 4 years. However, the reason for this was not about being disillusioned but because I was living in Newcastle/Australia so couldn't make games. I'm now back in Nottingham, and after going to a few games i realise maybe i had lost interest too.
Before the Boxing Day game I had the old sense of excitement I used to get when i was 15, yet the game to mewas a complete letdown. I thought the atmosphere was flat and the passion on the Ice seemed to be lacking. The Match Night presentation was especially poor. The continuous attempts to hear some noise from the Panthers fans seemed desperate and cheesy, and the CONTINUOUS adverts are extremely annoying.
I think I may have lost interest as I'm older, and having been away you lose contact with the sport, but I also think the match night presentation/atmosphere, and Panthers continued failure to take that extra step towards a title has an effect.
At the moment, with limied finances, i find it hard to choose Panthers over Forest. One club seems to have passion, desire and a brilliant atmosphere, the other seemsto be lack all three.
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Post by Hadden11 on Jan 14, 2010 15:23:56 GMT
Pretty much summed up my views there Samxpenguin. My main gripes are..
Match night presentation - been done a thousand times everyone knows what is wrong.
Fans - I cant cope with women screaming dire chants, handing out chocolate bars, showsec, happy clapping, the whole rasto end of the game routine, chelsea dagger ect
Player mentality - Eg Mcmorrow, how about instead of letting him run his mouth someone steps up and takes him on unexpected, show some balls. Finish your hits, fight for everything.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 14, 2010 19:10:00 GMT
I've written an article on TCW about this thread and also giving praise to the Steelers for an initiative they are bringing in for their fans. Credit where it's dueConstructive comments appreciated
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,422
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Post by iginla on Jan 14, 2010 20:35:43 GMT
Its a damn good idea from Steelers Jonno,assuming Mike O'connor is willing to take their comments and suggestions seriously.
Panthers fans have suggested a similar thing before however it has fallen on deaf ears with our management.
If you ask GM, he will say he "doesn't read the crap on the cage"but i certainly think he does because there are lots of things that happen or are said, or referred to by him over a season that would suggest otherwise !
Talking to a good selection of your fans is a very useful exercise and should not be dismissed out of hand.
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