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Post by Nemesis on Oct 29, 2006 9:12:54 GMT
The best team lost, simple as. Wasted far too much powerplay, one of our best players appeared to be slewed by Gustavson, and after a verbal assault by those wonderful Steeler fans Carson seemed hell bent on helping Sheffield claw back the scoreline. His overall performance however was diabolical, making bad calls both ways. All the penalty shots were laughable. Not too disappointed tonight, we lost on penalties but were much improved from previous games and obviously a better outfit than Sheffield. The rub of the green and the game would have been ours. P.S. All those Steeler fans cheering while McAslan was helped from the ice, real classy. Not condoning it by any means Mark mate, however, I was at the Manchester game the other week when Hecl got hit...............
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lakane
Jade Galbraith
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Post by lakane on Oct 29, 2006 9:17:57 GMT
i actually introduced a couple of people new to hockey last night and they loved it. now i've finished smarting over the result a little i suppose that game is all you can ask for (passion,guts and good atmosphere) not the most skillful of games but as long as your team gives its all then i'm happy. btw shuffs players missed out last night, you should have had a go on euro millions, you would have won it no probs
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Post by lockerbie on Oct 29, 2006 9:34:00 GMT
You were the better team tonight, we came from nowhere. I would have thought the Cloots win would have got our lot going TBH but it didn't. Those have got to be the 3 worst penalty calls I have ever seen, not one true pen between them! Hope McAslan is back quick sharp and I'm glad to see nobody making a big song and dance about what was a clean hit. I had the perfect view and his skate seemed to catch an edge and his leg got twisted. Dunno what else to say really, I'm chuffed to bits don't get me wrong but I can sympathise totaly after seeing my lot chuck a lead last week. An entertaining game in the end one that you bossed TBH. Edited to add. Carson has travelled with us before and probabley will again. He lives up our way. And that makes it alright does it. Very professional. Sheffield is hardly a million miles away and if Carson can't make his own way then that proves what a complete idiot he really is. Just adds to the mockery of the officiating. Just wondering also where you get the idea 'Clouthier' won that fight?
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Post by craigfx2o on Oct 29, 2006 9:34:39 GMT
P.S. All those Steeler fans cheering while McAslan was helped from the ice, real classy. And the Panthers fans in block 17 who threw beer into the Steelers end. Real classy.
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Post by lockerbie on Oct 29, 2006 9:37:15 GMT
This incident was the turning point, allowing them to go unpenalised was incredible and simply Carson lost it at that point. What incident are we talking about? Anyone who says that Carson was biased in favour of the Steelers must be sucking on sour grapes I'm afraid. You guys had a good number of five on three's and some of the penalties he called against us were shocking. The check by Sarich where he fell into your guy was called as boarding. Shocking!! Hip check by Darby at waist height called as tripping. Shocking call again!! Yes he was appalling, dreadful etc but not in favour of one team I'm afraid so put the conspiracy theories to bed. Bottom line is we were very lucky and on any other night you would have killed us. Blaming the ref however is laughable. You may be able to convince yourself that the hand of carson didn't greatly contribute to your win, but we all really know it did don't we. Prior to McAslan being taken out you were shocking!
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Post by craigfx2o on Oct 29, 2006 9:43:47 GMT
Wrong again. We were shocking all game!!!
At the end of the day if your powerplay was anywhere near good enough you could have scored a hat full in the last ten mins considering how many powerplays you had. I'm sure that in that ten mins we only had five skaters on the ice for about two minutes so how do you work it out that the ref contributed to our win?
You lost. You didn't deserve to. The ref wasn't to blame. Get over it!
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Post by Nemesis on Oct 29, 2006 9:48:13 GMT
Cloots win, genral concensus on all 4 fight forums and having seen 4 videos.
Carson travels with the Steelers at the behest of the league wherever possible to save expense money. Please highlight the part of my post that says 'this is OK because......'
Carson did have a massive influence, I agree. Shocking calls at times. Worst 3 penalty calls I have ever seen.
We were rubbish all night, it didn't change after you lost McAslan, god only knows how we got that game.
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Post by lps on Oct 29, 2006 9:50:46 GMT
Edited to add. Carson has travelled with us before and probabley will again. He lives up our way. Nemesis, is this confirmation that he did travel with the team then? If so, this has to be SO WRONG. Firstly, it puts Carson in a difficult position with respect to having impartiality - imagine the situation if he had sent off a couple of the players for bad mouthing him, then had to travel back with them. Secondly, they have ample opportunities to form a friendship (don't take that the wrong way). I noticed that during the period warm-ups/game Carson was in many more 'friendly' discussions with Steelers players than Panthers. It was the Steelers players that went to him at the end of the 1st period to talk to him. Then he spent approx 5 mins on the Steelers bench looking at the photographers camera - just wonder if he would have done the same if Panthers had asked him to go and see Dave Page. Doesn't it seem strange that we see a penalty shot at the NIC approx 1 every 2 years, yet he gives Steelers 2 in a period? Even most Steeler fans didn't think that they were. Just to add that I didn't think that ANY of the penalty shots called were correct, including the Panthers one.
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Smudge
Jade Galbraith
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Post by Smudge on Oct 29, 2006 9:51:03 GMT
A few observations:
Why were Ferrara and Cooke on the ice together in the final two minutes when Sheffield equalised. No disrespect to either as they both have cracking futures ahead of them, but surely you go with experience at that stage of the game. It was Ferrara who was out-muscled on the boards which gave Sheffield posession and the tying goal.
The above would be immaterial if we had a powerplay of any note. Five on three in particular is woeful, puck movement is very slow and predictable. You'd think with all the additional penalties ZT has resulted in, there would be a lot of time spent practicing powerplays.
While Tessier wasn't dynamite, I thought he had quite an influence on the game due to the fact that he must have played 40 minutes
Corey Neilson - can't skate, can't fight, what do you do. As he's probably one of our top three or four earners, he should be doing a lot better.
I don't think Carson was biased towards Sheffield at all. Agree with an earlier post which detailed the Sheffield penalties late in the third.
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Post by bobness on Oct 29, 2006 9:51:32 GMT
Soem observations from last night. Our 5 on 3 is wore than the 5 on 4, and that's bad. With ZT and a lot of minors, you'd think any decent coach would practice PP and PK til it's been done to death. We were woeful on the PP, could have won it easy. Is a crap PP a contractual thing? Steelers aren't bad but are hardly championship material on last night's showing. Same for us. Neilson impresses me less and less with every game. Did anyone else notice that the 4-4 goal came with Cooke and Ferrara on the ice for us? With the greatest of respect to them both, it was a strange call to send them out at that stage.
The game with everything though, talk about getting your £15 worth, even fireworks afterwards!
PS Shmyr and Clouthier's fight was almost in slow motion.
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Post by bobness on Oct 29, 2006 9:53:35 GMT
Smudge, the above is just plain spooky.
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Post by Nemesis on Oct 29, 2006 9:59:17 GMT
I don't know lps, I do know it has happened in the past on a few occasions.
I believe the pictures were to show that one of your goals should not have stood (in their opinion) on the basis there was a man in the crease. Please don't start shouting at me for this, it is not my opinion, just what I have been told was the reason, you asked so I told you. I am not in a position to answer any questions about it.
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Post by KimThePanther on Oct 29, 2006 10:00:48 GMT
Nemesis, is this confirmation that he did travel with the team then? I think this was quite a frequent occurance prior to the days before Nico Toeman and I don't think it had any influence on the result. He awarded us a dodgy penalty shot and then gave us 4.59 of powerplay in the final ten minutes (2.01 of which was 5 on 3) and we couldn't finish them off!
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Post by lockerbie on Oct 29, 2006 10:06:16 GMT
Wrong again. We were shocking all game!!! At the end of the day if your powerplay was anywhere near good enough you could have scored a hat full in the last ten mins considering how many powerplays you had. I'm sure that in that ten mins we only had five skaters on the ice for about two minutes so how do you work it out that the ref contributed to our win? You lost. You didn't deserve to. The ref wasn't to blame. Get over it! Oh, were you been, i've been sitting here eagarly awaiting your reply, The ref influenced the score beyond doubt. Handing out those penalty two penalty shots like no tomorrow. 4-1 and 4-2 down you had no chance, 4-3 is a completly different matter. He played a game of trying to even things out alnight especially after you lot had whinged that the was a panther in disguise. Your right the ref wasn't completely to blame but if that score line had remained 4-1 your forum would have been set alignt with Carson cheat jibes.
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BIG-BAD-TONE
Ashley Tait
...win or lose have a booze
Posts: 1,893
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Post by BIG-BAD-TONE on Oct 29, 2006 10:06:55 GMT
Great game between two sides that entertained Panthers took the first half of the game and Steelers showed grit and determination to come back I really enjoyed tonight's game it's just a pity our power play seems a bit sloppy or it could have been a rout but the positives are there it just shows we can play real good hockey when we want to and if we keep on playing like we did in the first two periods we will win more games than we lose
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moose
Jade Galbraith
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Post by moose on Oct 29, 2006 10:10:20 GMT
Lilcrazykim - thank you - the most well thought out and honest post on the whole of this thread
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Post by paek on Oct 29, 2006 10:12:14 GMT
Have Panthers ever had a good power play? I can't remember a good PP unit for love nor money
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Post by craigfx2o on Oct 29, 2006 10:13:46 GMT
Lockerbie you're obviously still smouldering from last night so I'm not gonna rise to it but one of your own has said everything that needs saying for me. He awarded us a dodgy penalty shot and then gave us 4.59 of powerplay in the final ten minutes (2.01 of which was 5 on 3) and we couldn't finish them off! Quite how you can be on the powerplay for five of the last ten minutes then complain that the referee is bias against you is unbelievable. Shocking refereeing yes but against both sides.
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Post by Nemesis on Oct 29, 2006 10:15:57 GMT
Did ME put the lines back to how they were pre CC last night? You certainly looked better. Tone is right, you will win more than you lose, the question is will Belfast slip up and have a bad couple of weeks as you have just had?
On recent form I cant see us any higher than 4/5, if we could consistently play like we did against Manchester we could challenge, but consistency seems beyond us at the moment.
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Post by paek on Oct 29, 2006 10:18:21 GMT
Tone is right, you will win more than you lose, the question is will Belfast slip up and have a bad couple of weeks as you have just had? In my opinion, yes they will. As an added bonus <if that's the apt phrase> we've had decent results against them this year, so if that continues I think any title aspirations will be okay.
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Post by Rob #12 on Oct 29, 2006 10:22:22 GMT
I am sorry, but the constant finger pointing on this thread is pathetic. So much so it is giving Panther fans in general a bad name, and I don't like it.
Carson was poor yesterday, but I was shocked at how many poor decisions Carson made in our favour. Sheffield got rough treatment, one example was the boarding call on Sheffield. Myers fell over, exactly like he did last week, when he injured himself. Myers does that a lot.
We had ample oppurtunity to kill the game, thanks to Mr Carson, but we didn't take them. I think Mike knows what is needed of us and if he steps into the breach for McAslan (hope he gets better soon), hopefully he can direct things on ice and lead by example.
Not gonna say much else as most of it has been said. I thought the Shmyr/Clouthier fight was even, but watching my video again, I would give an edge to Shmyr. Ryan made contact with lots of punches, whears Clothears didn't. He did however catch #27 with a good one before they went down, which was I thought it was a draw. But I guess different angles give different outcomes.
Rob
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Post by Nemesis on Oct 29, 2006 10:22:45 GMT
Having been 4-1 up and playing the better game against them twice this year and lost both, I can sympathise with you all completely! We will try again tonight, might even be able to do you a favour eh?
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Post by martinski83 on Oct 29, 2006 10:27:10 GMT
I am well aware of the bias shown by Andy Carson in Steelers v Panthers matchups and it makes me sick he's still allowed to referee games at this level.
However, despite giving out three penalty shots (the third was laughable, never, never in a million years was that even a penalty), Carson was no more biased towards them than he was to us last night.
I noticed he missed a lots of calls for us, but he missed equally as many for them. I was sad to see that Jody Lehman didn't pick up a minor for using his stick as a weapon on more than one occassion.
Does anyone fancy a mass emailing session to Mike Ellis?
**Dear Coach
When we are on the penalty kill we need to do three things: 1) Clear the puck. Get it out of our zone and stop generally fannying around trying to look fancy. 2) Stop playing Ferrara and Cooke on PK. They both have the potential to be good players, but they bring nothing to a pk unit. They can't defend and they wont score on the breakaway. They can score on a 5 on 3 powerplay so just don't go there. 3) Do not allow Corey Neilson anywhere near the ice. In fact on a penalty kill, if you ask me nicely he can have my seats on the stand. He gets caught in possession too much and cost us a goal against sheffield, 2 against hull and a goal against the caps.
Oh by the way, when we get on the powerplay, that means we have at least a one man advantage. We should use this to make attacking plays and score goals, not give ice time to young brits and lark about in our own zone. Keeping possession on the powerplay gives no psychological advantage over the opposition and it wont frustarate them as they expect to defend for two minutes.
Have a nice day and remember that shoddy tactics have caused us to lose against the Capitals, the Stingrays and now the biggest game so far this year, Sheffield at home.
Sweet dreams. ** End of email
Martin
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Post by Heanor Lair on Oct 29, 2006 10:35:33 GMT
I don't know lps, I do know it has happened in the past on a few occasions. I believe the pictures were to show that one of your goals should not have stood (in their opinion) on the basis there was a man in the crease. Please don't start shouting at me for this, it is not my opinion, just what I have been told was the reason, you asked so I told you. I am not in a position to answer any questions about it. Nem, would agree about our goal there was a man in the crease. I think the problem with Carson was that he makes a showing during the period break to look at his decision with the photographer. I think Carson should have been more discreet. Having said that with the 5 on 4 and 5 on 3 time in the 3rd, game should have been finished off by us and wasnt. HL
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DoUrden
Ken Westman
Squash Them Sheep
Posts: 2,645
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Post by DoUrden on Oct 29, 2006 10:38:45 GMT
You were the better team tonight, we came from nowhere. I would have thought the Cloots win would have got our lot going TBH but it didn't. Those have got to be the 3 worst penalty calls I have ever seen, not one true pen between them! Hope McAslan is back quick sharp and I'm glad to see nobody making a big song and dance about what was a clean hit. I had the perfect view and his skate seemed to catch an edge and his leg got twisted. Dunno what else to say really, I'm chuffed to bits don't get me wrong but I can sympathise totaly after seeing my lot chuck a lead last week. An entertaining game in the end one that you bossed TBH. Edited to add. Carson has travelled with us before and probabley will again. He lives up our way. And that makes it alright does it. Very professional. Sheffield is hardly a million miles away and if Carson can't make his own way then that proves what a complete idiot he really is. Just adds to the mockery of the officiating. Just wondering also where you get the idea 'Clouthier' won that fight? Was you saying the same thing last season then when one of the Ref's(can't remember which one) Spend most of the weekend handing round with the Panthers players and fans while over in Belfast? It makes no difference, once they are on the ice thay are neutral, they may be shockingly bad at times but they are neutral.
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