Shaggy
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Am I a cynical idealist or an idealistic cynic?
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Post by Shaggy on Oct 27, 2006 12:43:30 GMT
Shaggy et al, we will all see wont we, i as already said, I truly hope that panthers get it right this weekend and go on from strength to strength. HOWEVER lets say that our present slump does continue (and in 48 hrs we will know one way or the other) would you then agree that something needs to be changed and a player movement may well be an impetus that gets the team motivated again or would you bury your head firmly in the sand and hope it all gets better before it is too late? Wishy washy & at best, suggestive of what MIGHT occur this weekend Texpef. Stating " this might happen...and if it does should this happen" leads to only to a debate about " what ifs & buts." State what you believe will occur this weekend, and then we can go on from there. What's "wishy-washy" about recognising the fact that we just don't KNOW what will happen? Unless you can see into the future, the only intellectually honest way of looking at things is to state that the outcome is uncertain - which is just what Texpef has done. You can say "I think this will happen" all you like... doesn't make it so... surely it makes sense to accept that one might be wrong? I may (and often do!) disagree with Texpef's stance on many things... but he's being completely honest about not being sure what will happen. Reasoned analysis of the facts and probabilities beats blind faith any day.
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Milkman™
Les Strongman
Always Delivers
Posts: 5,300
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Post by Milkman™ on Oct 27, 2006 13:02:17 GMT
Im pretty sure this is juat a case of the rest of the league catching us up.
I believe we had the longest pre season, along with the little jolly over to Europe.
Now the other teams have had time to gel, they have shown us for what we are, yet again a nearly team.
Beating the Steelers isnt enough for me, for fudges sake home and away loses to Hull, whats all that about.
Ellis out
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Post by Peacock on Oct 27, 2006 13:06:43 GMT
I think you forgot these...[sarcasm] [/sarcasm]
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Post by lps on Oct 27, 2006 13:10:28 GMT
Im pretty sure this is juat a case of the rest of the league catching us up. I believe we had the longest pre season, along with the little jolly over to Europe. Now the other teams have had time to gel, they have shown us for what we are, yet again a nearly team. Beating the Steelers isnt enough for me, for fudges sake home and away loses to Hull, whats all that about. Ellis out Let's get Dampier back. He'll manage to persuade big Gav Fraser and Brem to make comebacks, then we can hit these Europeans with the infamous 'dump and chase' tactics
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Milkman™
Les Strongman
Always Delivers
Posts: 5,300
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Post by Milkman™ on Oct 27, 2006 13:16:42 GMT
A wins, a wins, a win
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Post by paek on Oct 27, 2006 13:20:22 GMT
Wishy washy & at best, suggestive of what MIGHT occur this weekend Texpef. Stating " this might happen...and if it does should this happen" leads to only to a debate about " what ifs & buts." State what you believe will occur this weekend, and then we can go on from there. What's "wishy-washy" about recognising the fact that we just don't KNOW what will happen? Unless you can see into the future, the only intellectually honest way of looking at things is to state that the outcome is uncertain - which is just what Texpef has done. You can say "I think this will happen" all you like... doesn't make it so... surely it makes sense to accept that one might be wrong? I may (and often do!) disagree with Texpef's stance on many things... but he's being completely honest about not being sure what will happen. Reasoned analysis of the facts and probabilities beats blind faith any day. No, Texpef is playing Devil's advocate & hypothesising about situations that may or may not arise come the final buzzer on sunday night. I've openly stated that I expect the team to rectify their current slump this weekend, but no where have I stated that belief as a given. I'll either be proved right or wrong and either way, I wont crow about it or beat myself up.
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Milkman™
Les Strongman
Always Delivers
Posts: 5,300
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Post by Milkman™ on Oct 27, 2006 13:29:59 GMT
I doubt Tex will be beating himself up, theres a long queue of folks wanting to do it for him.
He's been watching a lot of years and pretty much knows what he is talking about
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Post by paek on Oct 27, 2006 13:32:37 GMT
He's been watching a lot of years and pretty much knows what he is talking about So have I, so what's your point?
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Milkman™
Les Strongman
Always Delivers
Posts: 5,300
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Post by Milkman™ on Oct 27, 2006 13:39:44 GMT
I've openly stated that I expect the team to rectify their current slump this weekend, but no where have I stated that belief as a given. I'll either be proved right or wrong and either way My point is that you are on a win win with that statement. Dont rubbish other peoples opinions then sit on the fence
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Doughnut
Forum Admin
mmmmmm ... Doughnuts
Posts: 5,072
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Post by Doughnut on Oct 27, 2006 13:45:11 GMT
The doom and gloom people are on a win win with their statements too. If we win, they're happy about the win. If we lose they get to say "I told you so". Sometimes I wonder which some people would prefer.
For what it's worth I'm being neither pessimistic or optimistic about this season just yet. After previous seasons I refused to let myself get carried away with our form before the CC, and now I'm not letting myself get carried away with our form after the CC either. I'm just taking each game as it comes. I may let myself start to get excited if we're leading in January.
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Post by paek on Oct 27, 2006 13:47:29 GMT
I've openly stated that I expect the team to rectify their current slump this weekend, but no where have I stated that belief as a given. I'll either be proved right or wrong and either way My point is that you are on a win win with that statement. Dont rubbish other peoples opinions then sit on the fence If you're going to quote something I have stated, at least quote the entire post and don't be selective. I've openly stated that I expect the team to rectify their current slump this weekend, but no where have I stated that belief as a given. I'll either be proved right or wrong and either way, I wont crow about it or beat myself up. How is the above an example of sitting on the fence?
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Post by charlish2099 on Oct 27, 2006 13:48:37 GMT
do you no what i never noticed that before, good point doughnut, i have to say cautiously optimistic is my outlook on our team, but im a cautious person in general, in my heart i think we are going to have a good year.
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Milkman™
Les Strongman
Always Delivers
Posts: 5,300
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Post by Milkman™ on Oct 27, 2006 13:58:32 GMT
My point is that you are on a win win with that statement. Dont rubbish other peoples opinions then sit on the fence If you're going to quote something I have stated, at least quote the entire post and don't be selective. I've openly stated that I expect the team to rectify their current slump this weekend, but no where have I stated that belief as a given. I'll either be proved right or wrong and either way, I wont crow about it or beat myself up. How is the above an example of sitting on the fence? I'll either be proved right or wrong
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blackandgold
Pat Casey
In 1985-86 Jim Keyes Gave 110% Every Shift
Posts: 275
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Post by blackandgold on Oct 27, 2006 16:45:33 GMT
texpef
Just give in mate, as I have already said you have the "stop being so negative, give them a chance, things will turn around soon, think positive" camp, who it seems berate fans whose opinion differs.
Non of us who have posted on here saying we need team changes now have had a go at the above opinions but there you go Happy Clapping strikes again.
Shaggy you live in a bubble, you have not read my posts what so ever or got a grasp of what I am saying have you.
Once again texpef leave them to it, I hope they prove us doubters all wrong and AS I HAVE SAID BEFORE "I HOPE THE PANTHERS MAKE ME EAT MY WORDS".
If we progress through this weekend and get at least 2 points then go on to qualify for the CC next week with the current squad I am open to a forfeit of some kind......... yikes ;D
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Shaggy
Forum Moderator
Am I a cynical idealist or an idealistic cynic?
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Post by Shaggy on Oct 27, 2006 20:18:44 GMT
Oh do give it a rest, blackandgold.... your categorisation of anyone who disagrees with you as "Happy Clappers" is just the same old unthinking vitriol. And it's quite obvious that you have not bothered to read and understand what I and others have posted, so please don't try to transfer your inadequacies onto me.
But just for you, let's re-state the obvious... nobody is saying that they are happy with recent results, and nobody is blindly putting faith in the chance that the Panthers will spontaneously regain top form with no effort.
We're just not demanding firing squads yet, that's all.
You appear to have a very polarised view of matters and opinions - anyone who doesn't agree with you completely gets categorised as being the opposite extreme. Perhaps you could explore some more reasonable middle ground?
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MP
Paul Adey
Hail hurts and rain is cold. Summer in the mountains
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Post by MP on Oct 27, 2006 22:21:53 GMT
Gentlemen........... play nicely please - don't let this get personal.
I can't see any reason for panic - form can be as fickle as us Panther fans - it may return as quickly as it left (I hope!)
Mike Ellis certainly has work to do - something has gone wrong and it needs putting right PDQ.
What I and quite a few other people are curious about is why has the team had this sudden dramatic turnaround in form. The club insist the CC isn't the cause (well, wouldn't expect them to say anything else at this stage in time) but the speculation will continue - there doesn't seem to be any more obvious reason than the trip to France. What worried me a bit on Wednesday was that the demeanour of the team during the game reminded me of Blaiser's team last season and we don't want any rerun of their off-ice problems!
Fingers crossed that Mike and the lads turn things round tomorrow. A result and a decent performance against the Steelers will help lift the atmosphere. I'm not sure I expect a result against the Blaze - I don't honestly know enough about them so far this season to form a valid opinion.
This weekend's games will tell us a great deal about the character of our coach and team - by the end of next weekend we may well have a solid indication of how the rest of the season is likely to shape up.
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Post by Lucy on Oct 27, 2006 22:26:59 GMT
You know, sometimes I wonder how you pessimists must have felt for the first few games of the season. Your absence in posting praise was noted and it must have been really awful for you, not having anything to moan about. Strange how you didn't shout for changes to the successful team, but bring on a few defeats and all of a sudden it's all doom and gloom. There was even one post of Ellis out How on earth can a team that is still 2nd in the league get so much criticism. Oh Belfast lost - I wonder if their fans are moaning tonight!
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Shaggy
Forum Moderator
Am I a cynical idealist or an idealistic cynic?
Posts: 10,995
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Post by Shaggy on Oct 27, 2006 22:49:46 GMT
Gentlemen........... play nicely please - don't let this get personal. Fair enough by me... Exactamundo. It's a funny old sport.... downs can turn into ups just as fast as the ups turn into downs... and half the time us fans haven't got a scoobies as to why! (which is probably the reason for all the heated debate) Disagree. The most obvious reason is the change around in the lines. Missing Petricko, not playing James Neil much, shifting players around... makes sense to me as the reason for the lack of coordination etc. Damn right we don't.... although I wouldn't say that it was as bad a team demeanour as last year. OK - Neilson was sort of sleep-walking, McAslan was just going mental, Myers had a mardy fit and probably needed benching for a while, and Simoes just went a bit too far at the end with that misconduct penalty. But Lindsay was as businesslike as usual, Stevens, Myers and Moran were working hard, as was Krajicek (I can't blame him for blowing up at Hanson... that 'tripping' call was total ball-cocks)... even though it was bad, it still wasn't as bad as a lot of last season IMHO. <shrugs> sounds reasonable...
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blackandgold
Pat Casey
In 1985-86 Jim Keyes Gave 110% Every Shift
Posts: 275
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Post by blackandgold on Oct 28, 2006 14:07:00 GMT
Shaggy There are so many points in my post you just dismiss because you have tunnel vision, I have NEVER said that my point of view is final; in fact I’ve stated IMHO, something you put on your last post. End of the day you have your views why we should stick with the current roster and I have mine, as for saying I have inadequacies, your just pure class... At no point during my post I have stated my analysis is right, on the contrary I even agreed with many points in your original post, did you see that? Jesus some people
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Post by paek on Oct 28, 2006 14:46:59 GMT
With reference to changing players, the one that springs to mind would be Stevens. One PPG goal simply isn't good enough.
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