IT IS TIME .......

[texpef]

who is having a go at NB Andy? If it was aimed at me i was just saying management, not NB, and the fact that it "appears" to be the cheap option a la ceman regarding not replacing our injured "star" goal scorer rather than the infinitely easier cheaper option of just playing the coach. Do you honestly believe if this happened at sheffield they would not bring in a suitable replacement ie johnson for ricci for eg? Endemic throughout the club appears imho a feeling that good enough is just that rather than excelling and maybe then even winning things...

[newham]

pantherrich said:

Oh Newham, I agree with a lot of your post but to say we need Craighead back had me rolling on the floor, the only player I could think could make things any worse is JC!

When he was here he was a good wage, you cant compare Shmyr to Craighead in terms of replacement. Id rather have someone like Kalmikov in to replace Stevens and have Shmyr go out and give a few more cheap shots. Fair enough hes the perfect tough guy but we would benefit from him being a bit nastier.
Then id still give Neilson the benefit of the doubt for a couple more weeks and just get him working on his passing. If he could make simple passes he wudnt be out of position in the first place.

Altho if I could make 3 changes id bring in a sharpshooter for Stevens, a proven goalie if ones out there (Maybe CC) for Lids and a more reliable/all round D man for Corey

I disagree mate, we certainly need an enforcer but in this league i don't believe we can afford to have someone with so little on-ice ability too, we have to combine the two. Craighead looked after our players without having to fight and this allowed them to play and allowed him to score. Shymr might look after them, but as i've said, he doesn't do enough elsewhere to warrant his position.

[supermattytrickett]

andyd said:

Why do people always hammer Neil Black as is the case once again in this thread?

The guy is a business man and I'm delighted he keeps us on an even keel, no yearly fears of going under like other teams. He provides the money for the team up to the wage cap (and potentially a little further) as well as all the things that make Nottingham an attractive place to play.

So he lives in London? And? He comes to some games, is it that hard to believe that he came to the game last night not to give an earful about missing a pay day but to CHEER THE TEAM IN THE HOPE OF REACHING THE SEMI-FINALS? Let's always choose the negative though, eh?

Neil Black is not the bad guy...it never ceases to amaze me the flak he gets, what does he need to do to be appreciated? Come to every game, give the team talk, play on defence, sell the tickets and serve the tea? Sheesh.

To be fair Andy, who has nailed Black on this thread? Tex has made and clarified his point, whilst I was merely guilty of repeating what Neil Black was proudly saying to both the ice hockey press and the fans when he bought the ailing club back in the late 90's.

There was nothing nasty or vindictive towards the man at all. I actually think the problem lies lower in the Panthers hierachy than him, and thank Black for his unconditional financial support of this club and hope it continues for sometime to come.

[Spooks]

I think NB does what he does and considering there has been stable hockey in Nottingham for a good few years now in Nottingham then there should be more in the silverware cabinet apart from that ONE Challange cup win a few years back. New coaches have been and gone, ok this season isnt over yet but at the moment it doesnt look good for anything. So the only consitant factors are a few brits that arnt really that good, GM and some backroom staff.

TOTAL CLEAR OUT TOP TO BOTTOM and re-look at how the orginisation is run. For if moral is low again like it always seems to be this time of year and for the rest of the season then shake the whole thing up. Still its not going to happen as its the best team on paper..................................................................

[Rich]

newham said:

pantherrich said:

Oh Newham, I agree with a lot of your post but to say we need Craighead back had me rolling on the floor, the only player I could think could make things any worse is JC!

When he was here he was a good wage, you cant compare Shmyr to Craighead in terms of replacement. Id rather have someone like Kalmikov in to replace Stevens and have Shmyr go out and give a few more cheap shots. Fair enough hes the perfect tough guy but we would benefit from him being a bit nastier.
Then id still give Neilson the benefit of the doubt for a couple more weeks and just get him working on his passing. If he could make simple passes he wudnt be out of position in the first place.

Altho if I could make 3 changes id bring in a sharpshooter for Stevens, a proven goalie if ones out there (Maybe CC) for Lids and a more reliable/all round D man for Corey

I disagree mate, we certainly need an enforcer but in this league i don't believe we can afford to have someone with so little on-ice ability too, we have to combine the two. Craighead looked after our players without having to fight and this allowed them to play and allowed him to score. Shmyr might look after them, but as i've said, he doesn't do enough elsewhere to warrant his position.

But all we heard was "We need Craighead on the ice, he cant fight because he needs to score". We never knew which JC was going to turn up, he was lazy mardy and split the team, Shmyr isnt on the same payscale, improves team morale, will fight anytime and gives 100%.
Who would you replace him with? For the money hes likely to be earning theres no one out there better and even if you brought in an all star to replace him wed get pushed around all season anyway.

One problem people have with him is he breaks up plays coming away with the puck. Why the hell do we have to head man it to him everytime?? Il tell you, hes the only one back checking enough and making space for the breakout. Anyway were on a 9game losing streak, our enforcer is doing his job but the scorers arnt scoring, its a totally irrelvant conversation IMO. If everyone else did their jobs like Ryan we would still be top

[rangers]

[quote author=newham board=Hockey thread=1162732488 post=1162772210Petricko - Nothing personal, i just don't see him as being good enough. He has terrible finishing and doesn't put up enough points.
.[/quote]

Hate to say it but told you so. Not sure where he got this reputation. At bracknell he was never a big star, overshadowed by smital, massa, campbell. At Vipers when the big moments came, Petricko went missing. Morgan(before injury), Payette, Lobby, Jan, Trev and Weaver won it. Not Tricko.

If it were me, I'd swap Evan for Curtis, and gas Smear, Neilson and Tricko. But then the risk is the quality of replacements, but i'm sure ellis could find someone.

[Deleted]

The possibly replacements i think will be of a higher standard this year than in the past.

And no our NM is NOT the problem.

To me we need a top class scoring centre, Stevens works hard but we need points and goals.

And a rock solid stay at home d man to perhaps replace Neilson.

[Deleted]

l66cjh said:

hear a rumour last night that there was a canadian arrived at the arena with his bags supposedly had signed for the panthers and went by the name of sean but heard nothing to back this up

Well theres this Shawn

Posted 6/11/2006: ca Shawn Heins (D)
From ch EHC Basel to Unknown
Added By: Davide Tuniz, Status: Confirmed

Wow

Could raise a few eyebrows ;D ;D

[heja]

pidge said:

l66cjh said:

hear a rumour last night that there was a canadian arrived at the arena with his bags supposedly had signed for the panthers and went by the name of sean but heard nothing to back this up

Well theres this Shawn

Posted 6/11/2006: ca Shawn Heins (D)
From ch EHC Basel to Unknown
Added By: Davide Tuniz, Status: Confirmed

Wow

Could raise a few eyebrows ;D ;D

sign him up just for the hell of it gotta be better than nielson

[Mark]

My tenpenneth.

Evan Lindsey, I've defended him in the past but he lets in far to many soft goals. Is poor on one on ones and penalty shots and doesn't appear to step up for big games. Possible change.


Cory Nielson, lacking in every area. For an offensive defenceman hardly ever scores, poor positional sense, gets caught on the puck constantly and consistently fails to clear the zone. Definite change needed.


Rod Stevens, good workrate but achieves little. Doesn't score goals and is anonomous in most games. Definite change needed.


Matus Patricko, has shown fleeting glimpses of ability but must do much better. Another who doesn't score enough. No change yet but must improve considerably.


Matt Myers, plenty of effort and appears to have ability but plays most games like a headless chicken, racing around with little apparent idea of what he is attempting. Really must address his inability to stay on his feet and score a few more goals. No change.


Paul Moran, out of his depth and in my opinion, shouldn't be on this team. Would he really be playing for the Panthers if his father wasn't general manager? Poor positional play, poor passing, never scores and takes too many dumb penaties. Definite change, but it won't happen.


James Cooke and James Ferrera, above criticism in my opinion. Must be dirt cheap and are learning their trade. Would anyone be questioning their input if the more experienced players were performing? No change.


Geoff Woolhouse, not furthering his career warming the bench at Panthers but who else would fill his skates? Did fine when called upon in Rouen, making several exellent saves. No change.


Danny Meyers and Mike Rees, both pretty solid although a few mistakes have led to goals. Have however been our two most consistent D men who do their jobs with little fuss. No change.


Jan Krajicek, must do better in my opinion. Scored a few goals but neglects his defensive responsibilities and in some games has appeared to be very lazy. No change but more effort and defensive dilligence.


Blaz Emersic, exellent workrate although doesn't always achieve enough. Overall however is a solid performer who deserves his place. No change.


Ryan Shymr, does what he was employed to do. An intelligent enforcer who doesn't take needless penalties. Exellent on the penalty kill too. No change.


Steve Simoes, 100% every game. Turns up to play and a superb hitter. The one criticism is again a low return in goals but that is all. Definitly no change.


Sean McAslan, we're missing him like hell. He scores goals and is a real pain to the opposition. Definitely no change.


David Clarke, He's going nowhere.


Bottom line is we need changes now, the slide is running out of control.
Lets hope Mike Ellis is well on the way to getting things moving and Neil Black is prepared to back his coach 100%.
If not, the fans who turn up week in, week out are once again being short changed. I for one am tired of watching the same season over and over again.

[Deleted]

l66cjh said:

hear a rumour last night that there was a canadian arrived at the arena with his bags supposedly had signed for the panthers and went by the name of sean but heard nothing to back this up

That might have been Shawn Allard. He's the guy who organises the Hockey Stars for Hope games and he's Canadian. He was here with Bob Probert.

Amazing how these rumours get going, isn't it?

[Robbie Nud]

newham said:

hitman69 said:

Oh, and i'll add Shmyr to the list as well. He may be tough, but he does knacker all on the ice. Craighead had the same aura on the ice as he, but he also spent his time scoring goals. Shmyr doesn't even look like he's capable of getting a shot on target, let alone past a goalie.

This team would kill for another Craighead.

What tosh!!!
Shmyr is the enforcer, ok. He fights when he needs but doesn't take dumb penalties that will effect the team. He also brings more to the play than being a 'goon'. How often do other enforcers play the PP and the PK?
As for wanting another Craighead
Haven't seen Shmyr lording it up and down the ice giving it the 'big I am' or if things are not going right attacking the NM.

[andyd]

bucke said:

mythosman said:

Our esteemed owner only appears to take an interest in the Panthers when we start losing, and it was no surprise to see him circling the Arena last night – I’m sure the loss of an extra pay day of a Challenge Cup Semi-Final game has done little to improve his humour. Supposedly, he met with Coach Ellis after the game – I wish I could have been a fly on the wall at that one!

You are correct there, Mr Ellis did appear at about 11.10 last night and had obviously seen Mr Black who pointed out to him how many thousands of pounds he had just lost him. Typical. The poor guy look well choked up.

SMT and Tex, these were the two posts that led to my defence of Neil Black...it was nothing that either of you said.

[Rich]

Mark, I havnt been Myers's biggest fan but how can you say no change at the end? Hes the most changed man in nottingham from last season. Last season things didnt go well and he tripped over his bottom lip and let himself down, he did sod all.
This season, things dont always go well but he knuckles down and keeps working his butt off until things do click. I was almost dubious about him signing over the summer but would almost say he was my MOM sat.

And as for Krajicek, he sometimes gets caught out because hes trying to do too much but hes the best D man weve got and if our forwards pulled their weight and covered him when hes forced to make a play in the attacking Zone (because forwards are static breaking out) it wudnt be a problem

[EMB]

andyd said:

bucke said:

You are correct there, Mr Ellis did appear at about 11.10 last night and had obviously seen Mr Black who pointed out to him how many thousands of pounds he had just lost him. Typical. The poor guy look well choked up.

SMT and Tex, these were the two posts that led to my defence of Neil Black...it was nothing that either of you said.

Andy D I am not going to get into a slanging match with you here because everyone is entitled to their view but you are not here at the moment. With all due respect I agree with you about Mr Black we could do alot worse but he made it very clear about the money issue on Saturday and so he might its his club and his money, Mike Ellis knows the consequences thats his job but he doesn't need his nose rubbing in it either.

[Deleted]

bucke said:

andyd said:

SMT and Tex, these were the two posts that led to my defence of Neil Black...it was nothing that either of you said.

Andy D I am not going to get into a slanging match with you here because everyone is entitled to their view but you are not here at the moment. With all due respect I agree with you about Mr Black we could do alot worse but he made it very clear about the money issue on Saturday and so he might its his club and his money, Mike Ellis knows the consequences thats his job but he doesn't need his nose rubbing in it either.

What money issue, ?

If he can bankroll the team to travel to europe twice, he can afford two airfares for new incomng players surely.

[Mark]

pantherrich said:

Mark, I havnt been Myers's biggest fan but how can you say no change at the end? Hes the most changed man in nottingham from last season. Last season things didnt go well and he tripped over his bottom lip and let himself down, he did turf all.
This season, things dont always go well but he knuckles down and keeps working his butt off until things do click. I was almost dubious about him signing over the summer but would almost say he was my MOM sat.

And as for Krajicek, he sometimes gets caught out because hes trying to do too much but hes the best D man weve got and if our forwards pulled their weight and covered him when hes forced to make a play in the attacking Zone (because forwards are static breaking out) it wudnt be a problem

In my opinion there is rarely any end product from Myers, I don't dispute his workrate and as stated I would keep him, but he's got to work on his shortcomings.
Same with Krajicek, I'd keep him but for me he's got to do better at his main job, defence.
I can't comment on either of the weekend,s games, I had a prior engagement Friday and Saturday I wasn't prepared to cough up more money to watch Sheffield lord it over us at home yet again.
Seems I made the right decision.
Out of interest can anyone enlighten me on what Neil Black said after Saturday's game?

[Deleted]

Changes to the playing staff need to be made to kick start the season again, 10 games without a win is unacceptable and I think it is the only viable option left open to us now.
I said to MP after the game on Saturday, it's like Groundhog Day again! No matter who is coach, who is playing the same thing seems to happen!
I can perfectly understand newer fans saying the we should 'stick by the team', but after so many seasons of failure and having your nose rubbed in it year after year it really starts to wear you down, I was so dejected when I left the NIC on Saturday (so much so even Helen didn't gloat!).
Really have an empty feeling where the Nottingham Panthers are concerned at the moment, I just want us to have a little bit of success, but it never seems to happen
Sorry for the miserable post but I had to get it off my chest!

[newham]

chri5 said:

newham said:

hitman69 said:

Oh, and i'll add Shmyr to the list as well. He may be tough, but he does knacker all on the ice. Craighead had the same aura on the ice as he, but he also spent his time scoring goals. Shmyr doesn't even look like he's capable of getting a shot on target, let alone past a goalie.

This team would kill for another Craighead.

What tosh!!!
Shmyr is the enforcer, ok. He fights when he needs but doesn't take dumb penalties that will effect the team. He also brings more to the play than being a 'goon'. How often do other enforcers play the PP and the PK?
As for wanting another Craighead
Haven't seen Shmyr lording it up and down the ice giving it the 'big I am' or if things are not going right attacking the NM.

I haven't seen Shmyr doing that either, but then i haven't seen him doing.....anything yet. Sure, he plays the PP and PK but he is dreadful on it! He's one of the major reasons our special teams suck. He can't retain the puck and is dreadful at circling it on the odd occasion he does.

Everyone here seems to be anti-Craighead now he's gone. I bet these are the same people who hero-worshipped the man when he was here. Anyone would think he was Scott Allison.

[andyd]

bucke said:

andyd said:

SMT and Tex, these were the two posts that led to my defence of Neil Black...it was nothing that either of you said.

Andy D I am not going to get into a slanging match with you here because everyone is entitled to their view but you are not here at the moment. With all due respect I agree with you about Mr Black we could do alot worse but he made it very clear about the money issue on Saturday and so he might its his club and his money, Mike Ellis knows the consequences thats his job but he doesn't need his nose rubbing in it either.

Yes I currently live in a different country.

I haven't heard anyone else say anything about Neil Black saying anything whatsoever on Saturday, do you have special knowledge that others are not party to? (serious question not a dig)

The only place I've seen money mentioned last night was by Mike Ellis in the Evening Post and all he said was the losing the tie cost the club a lot of money which stands to reason as it's gate receipts that won't be received but that statement doesn't suggest that Neil Black is only interested in the £££ it seems like stating the obvious.

[Rich]

newham said:

chri5 said:

newham said:

What tosh!!!
Shmyr is the enforcer, ok. He fights when he needs but doesn't take dumb penalties that will effect the team. He also brings more to the play than being a 'goon'. How often do other enforcers play the PP and the PK?
As for wanting another Craighead
Haven't seen Shmyr lording it up and down the ice giving it the 'big I am' or if things are not going right attacking the NM.

I haven't seen Shmyr doing that either, but then i haven't seen him doing.....anything yet. Sure, he plays the PP and PK but he is dreadful on it! He's one of the major reasons our special teams suck. He can't retain the puck and is dreadful at circling it on the odd occasion he does.

Everyone here seems to be anti-Craighead now he's gone. I bet these are the same people who hero-worshipped the man when he was here. Anyone would think he was Scott Allison.

Not over here, I never liked JC. Try just spending some time watching Ryan, his game isnt the superstar game but he makes space and makes people know hes there aswell as giving 100%, just watch some of the things he does off the puck and watch how everytime theres a scuffle after a whistle our boys skate away more protected than the opposition. It might seem strange, pathetic even but for those guys to know they took cheapshots after a whistle then were able to skate to the bench grinning is a great feeling and gives them an edge for the next shift.

Mark, youve missed IMO Matts 2best performances this season then so its understandable but the end product will come, we know hes a good hockey player and when he hits better form (Which he is starting to) he will be a huge player for us I think. Also, how many FO's did Matt win sat?! I like his percentages, I cant remember Tessier winning one cleanly against him saturday and thats amazing considering he barely won one all of last season

[texpef]

read a few days previous to last weekend after we had lost mac, it mentions that NB/ME stated that they could save money by essentially playing the coach and not bringing in another player andy... something i as a panthers fan do not want to read as lets be honest here would not happen in the likes of sheffield/belfast both teams that want to win trophies..

[Shaggy]

newham said:

Everyone here seems to be anti-Craighead now he's gone. I bet these are the same people who hero-worshipped the man when he was here. Anyone would think he was Scott Allison.

Nope, a lot of us were anti-Craighead when he was AWOL-on-ice in his (abbreviated) second season here with us. Great talent, huge ego, terrible work ethic.

[newham]

Too true, but that clearly isn't the type of Craighead i'm clambouring to get is it? That first season was brilliant.

[twix]

newham said:

Too true, but that clearly isn't the type of Craighead i'm clambouring to get is it? That first season was brilliant.

Disagree. The beginning of the first season was brilliant. I was massively disappointed and unhappy with his re-signing for the second year as I disliked his attitude from xmas on in the first year. I know many fans who felt the same as was noticed in the texts I received on the day Panthers re-signed him. Too many fans were (IMHO) blinded by his off-ice public persona to see the damage he was doing to the team both on and off-ice