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Post by Samxpenguin on May 3, 2005 21:48:24 GMT
Anyone else noticed that those people who sell 'Socialist Worker' outside Marks & Spencer, are generally student types?. Socialist WORKER?? Try calling it socialist STUDENT, the majority aint ever done a proper days WORK. Gets reet on my baps does that! Theres a guy near us who send thier kids to a private school... and votes socialist allience.... hmmm, hypicrical?
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Post by ted on May 3, 2005 21:59:29 GMT
Do you have any idea what it`s like living with a Disability? That guy you work with is lucky to get a job at all.Why shouldn`t we(able bodied) look after those in our community who are unfortunate to be disabled. Also,why would anyone "pretend"to have Cerebal Palsy? My daughter is Autistic.I hope that when she gets older that she can be lucky enough to get a little job and get some sort of feeling of normality,something that the rest of us take for granted.I also hope that if she does then she doesn`t work with a narrow-minded person like you. Im not saying that he was pretending... im saying i dont know what it is that is wrong. He has mentioned Cerebal Palsy before (he is always one to make jokes about himself, im no doctor so i dont know what cerebal palsy is), but he has it all together, he is not mentally disabled in any way. At work, infact all his working life he has been doing the same job as every other able bodied person. My point is is that his disablitly doesnt effect him is such a way that he cant do the same job as me or that he cant get to work (he drives... like me, a similar distance). If I had hobbled my leg in an injury and claimed £200 a month tax free THEN got a job that pays £13k a year that involved sitting at a desk all day tapping at a keyboard, is my diablilty effecting my working life? no. if the only high paid jobs meant getting out an about and doing physical labour then fair enough, sub his wages... but lets face it, they dont, infact the only jobs his disabilty prevent him from doing are MOSTLY paid less than the job he does now. I realise i probably did come across rather badly in that post. I apologise. Except about Kilroy. Yes be proud of your own country, yes lets question the government about illegal immigrants, but lets not turn away genuine ones. When that guy told him 'Im going home in July' and Kilroy said 'Why not go tomorrow?' disgusted me to think that people actually agree with his mindset, that Great Britain should be for British only. We didnt deserve to have a British Empire if thats the sort of attitudes it breeds. Im by no means a radical lefty because i condemn racists, racial equality means that everyone has the same chance and if you would have read the rest of my post i did say i dont agree with the governments favour of asylum seekers over UK residents. I think on the same level though it has been over exaddurated in the press. Apparently (i have no figures for this) the numbers of illegal immigrants getting in now is no higher or lower than it was 10 years ago. Its just the papers seem to focus on it.
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MP
Paul Adey
Hail hurts and rain is cold. Summer in the mountains
Posts: 6,811
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Post by MP on May 3, 2005 22:17:45 GMT
the other point is the young yob culture we all have to put up with nowdays, i blame the parents too, and i am a parent, but would you agree that if there was more dicsipline in schools that would help. Yes, I'd agree with that. Several generations of parents have abdicated on their responsibilities to society with regard to instilling discipline into their children. Their lack of self-discipline has led to undisciplined offspring. In truth, society as a whole has stood back and let the yob culture take root. It may sound like a contradiction in terms, but for a democratic society to function for the good of it's majority, it's members have to abide by a set of reasonable basic rules. If everyone goes off and does their own thing then anarchy ensues. Discipline in schools? I'm darn glad I'm not involved in schooling in any way these days - I don't envy teachers one little bit. But for discipline to improve in schools it has to improve at home first - teachers need to be backed up by the parents.
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Matt
Simon Hunt
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Post by Matt on May 3, 2005 22:21:22 GMT
Anyone else noticed that those people who sell 'Socialist Worker' outside Marks & Spencer, are generally student types?. Socialist WORKER?? Try calling it socialist STUDENT, the majority aint ever done a proper days WORK. Gets reet on my baps does that! Me too! You`ll find that the majority of them come from middle/upper class backgrounds and are generally "rebelling"from their wealthy families by being involved with some fringe political,ragtag,rent-a-mob/protesters for a couple of years whilst at Uni,then off to a cushy job and a cushy life. By the way Wigwam,just thought i`d mention that at the playoffs weekend,I was standing "doing my business"in the loos,when this guy starts chatting away to me at the next "bowl",then turns around to face me only to realise that I am not you! He appologised for the mistaken identity,we laughed about it and off he went.
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Post by heja on May 3, 2005 22:22:02 GMT
Yes, I'd agree with that. Several generations of parents have abdicated on their responsibilities to society with regard to instilling discipline into their children. Their lack of self-discipline has led to undisciplined offspring. In truth, society as a whole has stood back and let the yob culture take root. It may sound like a contradiction in terms, but for a democratic society to function for the good of it's majority, it's members have to abide by a set of reasonable basic rules. If everyone goes off and does their own thing then anarchy ensues. Discipline in schools? I'm darn glad I'm not involved in schooling in any way these days - I don't envy teachers one little bit. But for discipline to improve in schools it has to improve at home first - teachers need to be backed up by the parents. i blame nothing but the parents we all went to the same school as some of the yobs and ifit was to do with scholl discipline surely there would be more people acting like yobs, rather than there being little groups everywhere
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andyd
Ken Westman
THE logo!
Posts: 2,719
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Post by andyd on May 3, 2005 22:24:41 GMT
Its all Labour's fault.
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Rhino#13
Jim Keyes
South Notts Outlaws Rule
Posts: 906
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Post by Rhino#13 on May 4, 2005 11:23:29 GMT
I don`t think Ted knows all the facts,I can`t see how this guy he works with can get an equal wage to everyone else AND claim disability benefits.The system does not work like this. I think he might be referring to Mobility Allowance. If someone has difficulty getting around, they may not be able to get to work without a car, so they get an allowance to afford one so they can work. Many areas have low floor buses and high bus boarder kerbs, but not everywhere so not every disabled person is able to use public transport. I've come across it at work, but am not sure of the exact process by which you qualify for it. Maybe this is what is being referred to rather than some sort of extra unemployment benefit. You need a Doctor to sign a statement to the effect that you have the disability and are affected by it in such and such a way though. People think the Council hands out these benefits willy nilly without checking up. Not true. Also, I reckon students should get grants if they're studying subjects for jobs the country needs. Doctors, nurses, engineers, teachers, etc. If someone wants to do a degree in Medieval History or Astrology or David Beckham they can pay for it themselves. True the job priorities might change by the time they graduate 4 years later, but probably not that much. Have we ever tried the scholarship system that the US uses ? That way we could reward the brightest and most diligent students from GCSE level regardless of how rich their family is. Seems like a good idea to be honest.
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Rhino#13
Jim Keyes
South Notts Outlaws Rule
Posts: 906
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Post by Rhino#13 on May 4, 2005 11:26:12 GMT
Does anyone else feel we're all sounding like the two cartoon blokes who 'don't do politics' in the Electoral Commission adverts by the way ? ;D
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Post by deutscherhockey on May 4, 2005 14:02:45 GMT
deutscherhockey.... Yes that is my point. My point isn't about 'Why isn't any party dealing with it'. Publicly funded people in medicine?. Yes there probably is, & that doesn't mean I or anyone else DOES or DOESN'T agree with it. Again..NOTHING to do with my original OR follow up psots Hitman, of course I respect your view, I aint saying either of us is right, it's just my own point of view. No laws say we must all agree. Luckily we all live in a democracy, & all views are valid & equal Wigwam ok I get your point. My response is that it seems unpopular with the political classes (who has that in their manifesto, for example?) and that presumably because no one would vote for it. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't hold to the view of course. I just hold the opposite view that's all. If I can put into a pot for our health care or our roads or our pension scheme then why not our education? Seems much of a muchness to me.
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Post by deutscherhockey on May 4, 2005 14:07:25 GMT
We need immigrants to do fill jobs that British people can't. . Just exactly what job can an "immigrant" do that a "British" person can't? Last time I looked they had pretty much the same capabilities. Or do you mean the pants jobs we British would rather leave to those who choose (or get sent?) to immigrate? That in itself would seem to be a rather racist attitude.
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Post by Emma11 on May 4, 2005 14:30:24 GMT
I had to pay for my education, as did my wife.... & rightly so. I didn't expect help from goverment or parents, & I didn't get it. If I needed money, I went out & earnt it. I also took out student loans, & paid them back AS & WHEN I gained full time employment. I wanted to better myself, but I didn't see why others should have to fund it. I still think that's the case. You want further education? Pay for it yourself!. i agree with you Tony, the way my family's finances are at the moment it means that i HAVE to pay for myself. I have a full time job to some extent and my university work on top of that! It takes a hell of a lot of juggling (not literally mind you) but if i want it bad enough then i will do it help or not!
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Post by Samxpenguin on May 4, 2005 14:33:13 GMT
I didn't mean that British people CANT DO, but that in professions that there are a lack of trained british workforce to take the places. hwthere that be as a specialist doctor or a builder, i never said or implied that this meant the 'pants jobs', that was something you made up in your imagination when reading the thread.
I don't see the problem in 'foreingners' working in this country in jobs that can't be filled by trained British people, without many foreign workers in Britain the economy wouild not be as strong as it is, and im sure neither would other proffessions. Im nto sayign we should open the doors to anyone who wants to come, what im ssaying is the right for free movement, and think the Immigration is greatly sensationalised and used as a 'fear factor'.
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Post by girdeaux on May 6, 2005 17:25:32 GMT
On whoever voted for the BNP.... I hope that it was just some twisted 'joke' or you pressed the wrong button. I thought hockey fans and the users of this forum at least to be a pretty liberal bunch. I dont like to think theres many right wing nazi tossers amongst us. I dont even need to go into my quarms with the BNP. That's quite an offensive comment in reality & it's pretty much bang out of order. I have no desire to ever give my support to the BNP & have no idea who voted for them on this little survey, but calling some one a " right wing Nazi silly person" only serves to make YOU look like an arse. If you can't have an intelligent conversation without resorting to childish remarks...Don't bother posting.
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Post by girdeaux on May 6, 2005 17:49:35 GMT
What success have far right parties had in Germany since the 1990's? Recent State elections, the National Democratic Party (NPD) did well in Saxony, while the German People's Union (DVU) likewise had success in Brandenburg. Both areas have poor economies since the collapse of the Berlin wall, and both NPD & DVU have indicated that they will merge to have a good assault on the Bundestag during the 2006 elections. They must be perceived to be a threat, as Schroeder wouldn't be attempting to ban the NPD Neo-Nazism on the rise in Eastern GermanyBlah blah blah I could go on, but I don't wish to enter into a debate with you.
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Post by thunder2 on May 7, 2005 22:21:30 GMT
Just to try & fill in a little regarding disability payments. There is DLA which is an allowance for anyone who has been diagnosed being disabled. ie Unable to walk distances unaided, Heart & breathing problems, MS etc. There is also an allowance called DWA. Disabled Working Allowance. My neice claimed this whilst still working when she ws 1st diagnosed with Multiple Schlerosis. When she was still able to go to work. This assisted in paying towards taxi fares to get her to work. When she became worse. this changed to mobility allowance which enabled her to lease a car. She also can claim carers allowance, This is to pay for someone to help her during the day and night, if she is unable to do things for herself. DLA,Carers Allowance & mobility give her a reasonable life. Cerebral Palsy is a diagnosis of anything from a very mild mental disability to a severe one.It covers a multitude of cerebral(brain) disorders. I have 2 family members who are both now looked after in care,(their parents have died) both are considered to have cerebral palsy and both are affected in entirely different ways, but both are very much disabled mentally.
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Post by deutscherhockey on May 8, 2005 7:11:27 GMT
Recent State elections, the National Democratic Party (NPD) did well in Saxony, while the German People's Union (DVU) likewise had success in Brandenburg. Both areas have poor economies since the collapse of the Berlin wall, and both NPD & DVU have indicated that they will merge to have a good assault on the Bundestag during the 2006 elections. They must be perceived to be a threat, as Schroeder wouldn't be attempting to ban the NPD Neo-Nazism on the rise in Eastern GermanyBlah blah blah I could go on, but I don't wish to enter into a debate with you. Fair enough. But the San Francisco Bay Guardian (your source) could have written a similar piece about the BNP in the UK with all its vague talk about "upswings" in support and polls of people who don't like foreigners. At one time I used to spend hours scouring the world's (and especially American) press and its accuracy when it related to things I knew about in the UK was on a scale from not having a grasp of the subject to laughable. Like you say blah, blah, blah.
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