GDT: Panthers 0:3 Devils (EL, 30/1)

[Deleted]

I heard the booing too, couldn't understand it and was hoping it wouldn't happen because I'd hate for it to become a pattern that whenever we lose, they get booed. I can understand the reasons behind a lot of people booing in the Fife and Coventry games but last night I felt we did everything but score and Cardiff just did everything better, and also scored. Frustrating, yes, worthy of a boo, no chance.

Ah well, the one thing that kept me smiling was that Salters penalty shot. Wouldn't have seen him take it as well as I did from my normal seat so I was thankful that someone booked them before I had chance to, and I also got to sit with more vocal fans for once.

[iginla]

What ever made you sit with the Devils fans Safety 3rd !

[Deleted]

Jan 31, 2016 13:26:37 GMT iginla said:

What ever made you sit with the Devils fans Safety 3rd !

Haha, I was after that rare-bit of atmosphere... I'll get my coat.

[iginla]

Haha,yes coat on for you mate.
You gotta get up early to catch me ! Lol

[Mark]

Management are the major culprits in all this. Ironic that a player we let slip in the summer killed us dead last night.

[iginla]

Two of em actually Mark !

[blackpanther2011]

bitterly disappointed about this team at the minute, we win good mid week game beating Clan on their ice not an easy task then don't turn up in one if not biggest games of the season so far. Title is just about obtainable but we need a bloody great big miracle to happen. I back what Mark said Why let a great player like Doucet go when he WANTED to come back and Corey didn't want him then devils sign him for 2 years. He was the best Panthers player last season though he played half a season with us.

Didn't go to the game last night but I think we should've gone with Madalora between the pipes, 1 shut out in 5 games riding a high and looked comfortable and seeing the puck like a beach ball. Yes I know Miika maybe rusty but come on. You don't just pull an inform Goalie for a returning one. (Unless your names CN) So far this season its always been former panthers killing us, Boxi and Beny (Bel) , Salters and Doucet (Car) and our so called Power play, heck we're non-existent in that department.

[Bagheera]

O.k. I'm gooing to try and break this down into where I see the issues. More for my own sanity than anything else. Thinking this over is driving mad.

4 or 5 seasons ago I was just a cage observer, never really posting. The thing that I always remember was that everboddies biggest issue was a lack of plan B from Corey. We then went on to win the GS and everybody kind of gave Corey some credit and cut him some and desrvedly so. However it now appears we have come full circle.

I'm not interested in a debate on the mnagement of the club at this time & most admit we have hugely missed a trick not getting in the extra Dman,so I am gonna leave those issues aside.

The obvious lack of plan B was no more obvious than last night.

Teams have worked out that all you have to do against Panthers is colapse around the goal and keep us to the outside. As you saw last night all that happens is that the D block the pucks from getting to goal, stock forwards getting in close and any shots that do get through are generally easy saves. If there is a rebound the D mops up. Thus Panthers look good in possesion for long periods without really threatening. Of course against lesser teams class sometimes tells and we get a few through.

The one thing we don't try, which to me is 1 of the obvious alternatives is to sit back and invite them on, then attempt to hit them on the break. No change for Ds to get set up. Now of course nobody wants us to play defensively all the time, but i'd take 2 points over fancy hockey any day.
So what do we chose to do to get up the other end? Take it slow and reset the play from behind our own net allowing the opposition to clog the neutral zone then colapse around the goal when we gain the zone.

Very clear to me that there is no plan B and that is squarely at 1 mans door.

On to lines. Now I have slaughtered Corey as much as anybody for pix and mix lines but it does appear he is settling them somewhat over the last 4/5 games(post special teams aside). There is still the odd change game to game.
All he has now done is make it obvious that he doesn't know what players to put together. We beat Belfast with set lines but we havn't seen that set up since.

Last night it was primerally.

Kolnik, Moran, Clarke

Bohmbach, Schultz, Lacho

Farmer, Lawrence, Janssen

McMillan, Myers, Ling.

Im quite happy with 1 and 2 on my list but the other 2 is where I really have a problem. We are struggling to score goals. Our top scorer from last season whom many are now saying is much improved because of increased work rate is playing on a line with Farmer & Janssen. Who exactly is supposed to be setting up the goal scorer??? Perhaps he could do with a top passer who can put the puck on anyboddies tape from anywhere on the ice?? Like the guy playing on thr 4th line with no natural goal scorer(Ling if you aren't sure).
Drop Cam down and allow that to be an out and out energy line.

Again above down to coaching.

Then there is the use of Janssen. Last night pretty much proved what Isaid at the Fife game. The game where we saw Cam allowed to play his role for the first time in a long time. It has become quite clear that Neilson doesn't value him on the team and just sees him as a fans player. In the lesser games such as Fife he lets him play his game. In the big games like last night he is ALMOST annouymous. Not once last night was there even close to Cam ruffling a few feathers. This can't be Cams choice as thats essentially his job.

The coach again must be making that decission. Also could have been plan B or C to try and mix things up.

Powerplay. Now long winded explanation needed. COACH.

Steve Lee ice time(aside the lack of D which he may be the decision maker for). Could be using Oakford more. COACH!

Finally the real proof lies in the fact thag its hard to pick any imports you can catagorically say you do not want back. The effort is by enlarge there, the talent is there. De ission making and stup isn't.

[dexter]

Seems a pretty good analysis to me. Correct the issues identified, add in the two players I think we're missing and bingo we've won the league!

[marshalfish]

Jan 31, 2016 15:05:59 GMT Bagheera said:

O.k. I'm gooing to try and break this down into where I see the issues. More for my own sanity than anything else. Thinking this over is driving mad.

4 or 5 seasons ago I was just a cage observer, never really posting. The thing that I always remember was that everboddies biggest issue was a lack of plan B from Corey. We then went on to win the GS and everybody kind of gave Corey some credit and cut him some and desrvedly so. However it now appears we have come full circle.

I'm not interested in a debate on the mnagement of the club at this time & most admit we have hugely missed a trick not getting in the extra Dman,so I am gonna leave those issues aside.

The obvious lack of plan B was no more obvious than last night.

Teams have worked out that all you have to do against Panthers is colapse around the goal and keep us to the outside. As you saw last night all that happens is that the D block the pucks from getting to goal, stock forwards getting in close and any shots that do get through are generally easy saves. If there is a rebound the D mops up. Thus Panthers look good in possesion for long periods without really threatening. Of course against lesser teams class sometimes tells and we get a few through.

The one thing we don't try, which to me is 1 of the obvious alternatives is to sit back and invite them on, then attempt to hit them on the break. No change for Ds to get set up. Now of course nobody wants us to play defensively all the time, but i'd take 2 points over fancy hockey any day.
So what do we chose to do to get up the other end? Take it slow and reset the play from behind our own net allowing the opposition to clog the neutral zone then colapse around the goal when we gain the zone.

Very clear to me that there is no plan B and that is squarely at 1 mans door.

On to lines. Now I have slaughtered Corey as much as anybody for pix and mix lines but it does appear he is settling them somewhat over the last 4/5 games(post special teams aside). There is still the odd change game to game.
All he has now done is make it obvious that he doesn't know what players to put together. We beat Belfast with set lines but we havn't seen that set up since.

Last night it was primerally.

Kolnik, Moran, Clarke

Bohmbach, Schultz, Lacho

Farmer, Lawrence, Janssen

McMillan, Myers, Ling.

Im quite happy with 1 and 2 on my list but the other 2 is where I really have a problem. We are struggling to score goals. Our top scorer from last season whom many are now saying is much improved because of increased work rate is playing on a line with Farmer & Janssen. Who exactly is supposed to be setting up the goal scorer??? Perhaps he could do with a top passer who can put the puck on anyboddies tape from anywhere on the ice?? Like the guy playing on thr 4th line with no natural goal scorer(Ling if you aren't sure).
Drop Cam down and allow that to be an out and out energy line.

Again above down to coaching.

Then there is the use of Janssen. Last night pretty much proved what Isaid at the Fife game. The game where we saw Cam allowed to play his role for the first time in a long time. It has become quite clear that Neilson doesn't value him on the team and just sees him as a fans player. In the lesser games such as Fife he lets him play his game. In the big games like last night he is ALMOST annouymous. Not once last night was there even close to Cam ruffling a few feathers. This can't be Cams choice as thats essentially his job.

The coach again must be making that decission. Also could have been plan B or C to try and mix things up.

Powerplay. Now long winded explanation needed. COACH.

Steve Lee ice time(aside the lack of D which he may be the decision maker for). Could be using Oakford more. COACH!

Finally the real proof lies in the fact thag its hard to pick any imports you can catagorically say you do not want back. The effort is by enlarge there, the talent is there. De ission making and stup isn't.

Pretty much sums up my thoughts entirely. One thing that really gets to me is that Neilson never seems to talk to the players during a game. Good shift or bad shift he never seems to offer any direction or constructive criticism. Surely his job doesn't end with the first face off.

[The Flying Shirt]

Jan 31, 2016 16:16:34 GMT marshalfish said:

Jan 31, 2016 15:05:59 GMT Bagheera said:

O.k. I'm gooing to try and break this down into where I see the issues. More for my own sanity than anything else. Thinking this over is driving mad.

4 or 5 seasons ago I was just a cage observer, never really posting. The thing that I always remember was that everboddies biggest issue was a lack of plan B from Corey. We then went on to win the GS and everybody kind of gave Corey some credit and cut him some and desrvedly so. However it now appears we have come full circle.

I'm not interested in a debate on the mnagement of the club at this time & most admit we have hugely missed a trick not getting in the extra Dman,so I am gonna leave those issues aside.

The obvious lack of plan B was no more obvious than last night.

Teams have worked out that all you have to do against Panthers is colapse around the goal and keep us to the outside. As you saw last night all that happens is that the D block the pucks from getting to goal, stock forwards getting in close and any shots that do get through are generally easy saves. If there is a rebound the D mops up. Thus Panthers look good in possesion for long periods without really threatening. Of course against lesser teams class sometimes tells and we get a few through.

The one thing we don't try, which to me is 1 of the obvious alternatives is to sit back and invite them on, then attempt to hit them on the break. No change for Ds to get set up. Now of course nobody wants us to play defensively all the time, but i'd take 2 points over fancy hockey any day.
So what do we chose to do to get up the other end? Take it slow and reset the play from behind our own net allowing the opposition to clog the neutral zone then colapse around the goal when we gain the zone.

Very clear to me that there is no plan B and that is squarely at 1 mans door.

On to lines. Now I have slaughtered Corey as much as anybody for pix and mix lines but it does appear he is settling them somewhat over the last 4/5 games(post special teams aside). There is still the odd change game to game.
All he has now done is make it obvious that he doesn't know what players to put together. We beat Belfast with set lines but we havn't seen that set up since.

Last night it was primerally.

Kolnik, Moran, Clarke

Bohmbach, Schultz, Lacho

Farmer, Lawrence, Janssen

McMillan, Myers, Ling.

Im quite happy with 1 and 2 on my list but the other 2 is where I really have a problem. We are struggling to score goals. Our top scorer from last season whom many are now saying is much improved because of increased work rate is playing on a line with Farmer & Janssen. Who exactly is supposed to be setting up the goal scorer??? Perhaps he could do with a top passer who can put the puck on anyboddies tape from anywhere on the ice?? Like the guy playing on thr 4th line with no natural goal scorer(Ling if you aren't sure).
Drop Cam down and allow that to be an out and out energy line.

Again above down to coaching.

Then there is the use of Janssen. Last night pretty much proved what Isaid at the Fife game. The game where we saw Cam allowed to play his role for the first time in a long time. It has become quite clear that Neilson doesn't value him on the team and just sees him as a fans player. In the lesser games such as Fife he lets him play his game. In the big games like last night he is ALMOST annouymous. Not once last night was there even close to Cam ruffling a few feathers. This can't be Cams choice as thats essentially his job.

The coach again must be making that decission. Also could have been plan B or C to try and mix things up.

Powerplay. Now long winded explanation needed. COACH.

Steve Lee ice time(aside the lack of D which he may be the decision maker for). Could be using Oakford more. COACH!

Finally the real proof lies in the fact thag its hard to pick any imports you can catagorically say you do not want back. The effort is by enlarge there, the talent is there. De ission making and stup isn't.

Pretty much sums up my thoughts entirely. One thing that really gets to me is that Neilson never seems to talk to the players during a game. Good shift or bad shift he never seems to offer any direction or constructive criticism. Surely his job doesn't end with the first face off.

Especially if he is going to publicly blame them after.

[Gawdonbennett]

Jan 31, 2016 13:23:49 GMT @safety3rd said:

I heard the booing too, couldn't understand it and was hoping it wouldn't happen because I'd hate for it to become a pattern that whenever we lose, they get booed. I can understand the reasons behind a lot of people booing in the Fife and Coventry games but last night I felt we did everything but score and Cardiff just did everything better, and also scored. Frustrating, yes, worthy of a boo, no chance.

Ah well, the one thing that kept me smiling was that Salters penalty shot. Wouldn't have seen him take it as well as I did from my normal seat so I was thankful that someone booked them before I had chance to, and I also got to sit with more vocal fans for once.

I agree the booing was not warranted last night. Up until the ref's poor call on Clarke (handbags) it was evenly balanced & an intriguing game. A few players looked fed up towards the end but on the whole I appreciated their effort throughout. The key difference between the two sides was that one has had strong management backing to pursue it's goal whilst the other has been gleefully ringing the tills. Cardiff were very well organised in defence & clinical in attack & oddly enough it was entertaining to watch. They fully deserve the title based on what I've seen of them & I hope they achieve it. Going forward we need to get behind the players in trying to achieve some success from this season but booing them when they have simply been beaten by a better team won't help.

[The Flying Shirt]

Jan 31, 2016 16:32:40 GMT Gawdonbennett said:

Jan 31, 2016 13:23:49 GMT @safety3rd said:

I heard the booing too, couldn't understand it and was hoping it wouldn't happen because I'd hate for it to become a pattern that whenever we lose, they get booed. I can understand the reasons behind a lot of people booing in the Fife and Coventry games but last night I felt we did everything but score and Cardiff just did everything better, and also scored. Frustrating, yes, worthy of a boo, no chance.

Ah well, the one thing that kept me smiling was that Salters penalty shot. Wouldn't have seen him take it as well as I did from my normal seat so I was thankful that someone booked them before I had chance to, and I also got to sit with more vocal fans for once.

I agree the booing was not warranted last night. Up until the ref's poor call on Clarke (handbags) it was evenly balanced & an intriguing game. A few players looked fed up towards the end but on the whole I appreciated their effort throughout. The key difference between the two sides was that one has had strong management backing to pursue it's goal whilst the other has been gleefully ringing the tills. Cardiff were very well organised in defence & clinical in attack & oddly enough it was entertaining to watch. They fully deserve the title based on what I've seen of them & I hope they achieve it. Going forward we need to get behind the players in trying to achieve some success from this season but booing them when they have simply been beaten by a better team won't help.

So CN's match report couldn't have helped much either then? This isn't about one game, it's about the last few weeks since Christmas on the whole and even if it gives GM something to have to edit out of the match DVD's it's worth every second. The booing isn't aimed at the players. It's aimed at a greedy owner, constant excuses and an inept coach (one inept coach as I'm not sure what the other one does).

[Gawdonbennett]

Jan 31, 2016 16:37:58 GMT The Flying Shirt said:

Jan 31, 2016 16:32:40 GMT Gawdonbennett said:

I agree the booing was not warranted last night. Up until the ref's poor call on Clarke (handbags) it was evenly balanced & an intriguing game. A few players looked fed up towards the end but on the whole I appreciated their effort throughout. The key difference between the two sides was that one has had strong management backing to pursue it's goal whilst the other has been gleefully ringing the tills. Cardiff were very well organised in defence & clinical in attack & oddly enough it was entertaining to watch. They fully deserve the title based on what I've seen of them & I hope they achieve it. Going forward we need to get behind the players in trying to achieve some success from this season but booing them when they have simply been beaten by a better team won't help.

So CN's match report couldn't have helped much either then? This isn't about one game, it's about the last few weeks since Christmas on the whole and even if it gives GM something to have to edit out of the match DVD's it's worth every second. The booing isn't aimed at the players. It's aimed at a greedy owner, constant excuses and an inept coach (one inept coach as I'm not sure what the other one does).

I've not had the time or inclination to pick up the match report to be honest. I understood the booing over Christmas and also where it was aimed at (think we've all had our say on that on another thread) ;-). I'm just not convinced that the players would have understood last night that the booing was not necessarily aimed at them, rather than at the management. Agree on Rick, he seems to have done a Lord Lucan last couple of season's.

[spik]

Jan 31, 2016 1:59:24 GMT kievthegreat said:

Jan 31, 2016 0:40:32 GMT Yotes said:

My understanding, which could well be incorrect, is that it's only shots that would've gone in but for the intervention of the netminder that count as shots, or shots that do go in of course. Presumably because it's a netminding statistic. Blocked shots are counted as just that. Even a shot that hits the frame and stays out doesn't count, as I understand it.

Indeed. Blocked shots don't (Shouldn't) count.

I'd have a brilliant percentage save then.Leave my crease and blame the defence.
Wonder what the total goals that would have been then against netminders who luckily had a block from the D yet would have not got to save it otherwise.

[Ian]

Beaten by a much better side. Devils were stronger, sharper, more balanced and had greater quality in every aspect of the game.

No lack of effort I didn't think - the biggest problem is with the coaching. The balance of the team is wrong, there's no stability in the combinations and the tactics used are ineffective with no flexibility to change things mid-game. We have loads of playmakers on the roster and we do have players who can score. What we lack most is a real poacher, someone who can get in the right areas all the time, pick up the rebounds, get the scrappy goals - that is what you need to break open a tight game at the business end of the season. And we just don't have it. Devils' third goal summed it up for me - we had the puck in the offensive zone but all three of our forwards were behind the Cardiff goal line (all three were playmakers) so for us to get a shot one of the D-men has to move up into the slot. We lose posession, guess what happens, Devils have a 2-on-1 and put it away clinically.

League has gone, our inability to break open a tight game doesn't fill me with confidence for the cup or playoffs either if I'm honest. New ideas and a fresh approach behind the bench urgently required.

[PantherTom]

Jan 31, 2016 14:41:03 GMT blackpanther2011 said:

bitterly disappointed about this team at the minute, we win good mid week game beating Clan on their ice not an easy task then don't turn up in one if not biggest games of the season so far. Title is just about obtainable but we need a bloody great big miracle to happen. I back what Mark said Why let a great player like Doucet go when he WANTED to come back and Corey didn't want him then devils sign him for 2 years. He was the best Panthers player last season though he played half a season with us.

Didn't go to the game last night but I think we should've gone with Madalora between the pipes, 1 shut out in 5 games riding a high and looked comfortable and seeing the puck like a beach ball. Yes I know Miika maybe rusty but come on. You don't just pull an inform Goalie for a returning one. (Unless your names CN) So far this season its always been former panthers killing us, Boxi and Beny (Bel) , Salters and Doucet (Car) and our so called Power play, heck we're non-existent in that department.

Panthers wanted doucett back.. He wanted to go Cardiff

[iginla]

Doucet wanted to get signed early.
We didn't have a coach to sign him because Mr Black didn't want Corey back.
Doucet wouldn't hang around waiting so signed in Cardiff.
Nobody else wanted the Panthers job,so we ended up with Neilson back again.

By which time.....Doucet was gone !!!!!

[EMB]

But Doucet actually stated that he came to panthers because at the time Lord couldn't guarantee him a full time slot but could the following season & Cardiff is where he wanted to be. Hasn't he also signed a 2yr deal. On a side note I hear Janssen wants to stay, I assume that will still stand whether Corey is here or not, maybe GM will sign him irrespective of who's coach, ab it like the Craighead saga.

[Thomas Elliott]

Jan 29, 2016 18:54:23 GMT titch said:

Jan 26, 2016 12:54:03 GMT Thomas Elliott said:

I'll have what he's having!!

Seriously though, win this and we're not "right back in the league". It's a massive step, but lose the following game and it means nothing. The way I see it, there are 32 points left for us to get in the league, 28 points puts us 1 point ahead of Cardiff and top of the league based on current points per game, and that doesn't take into account Braehead's "easier" run of games. What that means is that Panthers can only really afford to drop 4 more points throughout the entire season, and I don't think we're consistent enough to do that.

It's called be a positive person/fan, half of our fan base should try it sometime instead of being whiny depressing boring old farts that should stick to sitting in their armchair at home depressing their life away, shame that accounts for most people on this forum!

We're technically two points away from both Steelers & Cardiff and Braehead's wheels are starting to fall off, there is no reason why we can't take control of the league in the next few games. We seem to have picked up the form before the horrible christmas period. You'll see.

Yep... I really did see didn't I!! I feel so foolish.

There's a difference between being a "whiny depressing boring old fart" (I'm 26 by the way) and being realistic with our chances. Regardless of the result on Saturday, a win in that game would not have put us "right back in the league". It would have certainly helped, but an extended run is what we need(ed) not the one win against the team at the top.

[Deleted]

Jan 31, 2016 22:44:12 GMT iginla said:

Doucet wanted to get signed early.
We didn't have a coach to sign him because Mr Black didn't want Corey back.
Doucet wouldn't hang around waiting so signed in Cardiff.
Nobody else wanted the Panthers job,so we ended up with Neilson back again.

By which time.....Doucet was gone !!!!!

The bit where you say nobody wanted the Panthers job. How far wide did we search for a new coach, within a 50 mile radius or to unknown NA coaches in the minors ?

[EMB]

Probably as far as Chuck Weber Ian but he saw sense & stayed at Coventry

[Ian]

Feb 1, 2016 9:48:29 GMT @pidge said:

The bit where you say nobody wanted the Panthers job. How far wide did we search for a new coach, within a 50 mile radius or to unknown NA coaches in the minors ?

Think we both know the answer to that one mate.

[The Flying Shirt]

Feb 1, 2016 9:48:29 GMT @pidge said:

Jan 31, 2016 22:44:12 GMT iginla said:

Doucet wanted to get signed early.
We didn't have a coach to sign him because Mr Black didn't want Corey back.
Doucet wouldn't hang around waiting so signed in Cardiff.
Nobody else wanted the Panthers job,so we ended up with Neilson back again.

By which time.....Doucet was gone !!!!!

The bit where you say nobody wanted the Panthers job. How far wide did we search for a new coach, within a 50 mile radius or to unknown NA coaches in the minors ?

They pinned a card up in the Ice Locker shop next to the sticks.

[iginla]

Well apparently Pidge.

Thompson said,he would only come if he could bring Simmsey.
Blaisdell said,never again,i came twice and that was enough.
Adey said,you can't afford me.
Finnerty said,no thanks i've got more chance of winning the league in Braehead.
Lord said,only if I can have 17 imports and the answer was no !
Chuck Weber just laughed and said,no I prefer a club with ambition so I'm staying here.
Walser said,yes but I want 6 import Dmen and was promptly told he could only have 3 and that includes you.
Emmerson said,he preferred the bigger budget in Edinburgh.
Lefebre said,sorry I'm still a Steeler really.
And unfortunately,all the foreigners had already heard of Gary Moran,so that knackered that !!!!