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Post by Rob Scott on Oct 3, 2017 23:50:37 GMT
Tonight the trust stood up for itself and its numerous members. We won't be giving up and we won't be shouted down. Anyway, happy to pick things up with anyone who wants to tomorrow but as for tonight I'm way to busy watching highlights on repeat and celebrating.
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Post by pantherdman on Oct 4, 2017 5:22:45 GMT
Would be interested to see / hear it if anyone recorded it? No chance of getting there at that time on a working day.
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Shaggy
Forum Moderator
Am I a cynical idealist or an idealistic cynic?
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Post by Shaggy on Oct 4, 2017 6:10:24 GMT
Tonight the Trust got shot down and shown up for what it really is. Well to be honest it isn’t anything and never will be! Tonight the trust stood up for itself and its numerous members. We won't be giving up and we won't be shouted down. Anyway, happy to pick things up with anyone who wants to tomorrow but as for tonight I'm way to busy watching highlights on repeat and celebrating. Two completely meaningless statements as it stands, without any actual explanation. Would anybody care to provide such?
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Post by kezypanther on Oct 4, 2017 7:43:26 GMT
couldn't make this. Surely someone recorded it like last time or can give us some info on what was said??
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Post by kievthegreat on Oct 4, 2017 7:53:39 GMT
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Post by thebestpanthers on Oct 4, 2017 9:24:30 GMT
I'm not one to be paranoid or wear a tin foil hat so if the club say Black had transport issues, getting to a evening midweek game.. Then I'm happy to accept that. Like most with a concept of how the world works. Do you believe in Santa Claus, unicorns & that the moon landings were real as well? After last nights game --------------------YES
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Post by mardibum on Oct 4, 2017 9:33:14 GMT
Tonight the Trust got shot down and shown up for what it really is. Well to be honest it isn’t anything and never will be! Tonight the trust stood up for itself and its numerous members. We won't be giving up and we won't be shouted down. Anyway, happy to pick things up with anyone who wants to tomorrow but as for tonight I'm way to busy watching highlights on repeat and celebrating. Two completely meaningless statements as it stands, without any actual explanation. Would anybody care to provide such?
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Post by thebestpanthers on Oct 4, 2017 9:33:15 GMT
Tonight the Trust got shot down and shown up for what it really is. Well to be honest it isn’t anything and never will be! Tonight the trust stood up for itself and its numerous members. We won't be giving up and we won't be shouted down. Anyway, happy to pick things up with anyone who wants to tomorrow but as for tonight I'm way to busy watching highlights on repeat and celebrating. Two completely meaningless statements as it stands, without any actual explanation. Would anybody care to provide such? Welcome to the Media world - like most things, unless you see it, or hear it directly then it can be doctored. Even if you are there, the media will twist it to make you wonder if you really heard it, or "it was taken out of context" - hear what you want to hear, see what you want to see, believe no-one
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Post by mardibum on Oct 4, 2017 9:50:42 GMT
The way I heard it (and I couldn't make either the Q&A or the game!!) Black said he hadn't threatened the Trust and he had offered a meeting in Nottingham. If you believe the post on the Trust website ( and I've no reason to disbelieve it as it seems to be backed by Supporters Direct), then this is blatantly untrue and I can certainly understand the reaction of the Trust member at being called a liar in public. I would have been incensed! Have you read the post on the NIHST website, Adam? I think the member's comments about the Trust standing up for itself is probably due to sheer frustration at the club's continuing refusal to engage. Cardiff have, why not us? What have they got to hide? I don't think for a moment that, short-term, the club will engage. So maybe, Trust, it's time to take the gloves off and publish all of your evidence and let everyone make up their own minds who the villain of this piece is. The initiative to enforce dialogue with Supporters Trusts and the football clubs they represent came from the goverment. I think that maybe this a route the Trust could explore to ensure that Trusts in ALL sports have the same rights.
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Robbie Nud
David Clarke
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Posts: 3,101
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Post by Robbie Nud on Oct 4, 2017 10:43:45 GMT
Just for those that are asking. Supporters Trust communicationThis was posted on their website on 26th September after it have been sent out to the members.
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Post by pingchowchi on Oct 4, 2017 10:48:46 GMT
I thought last night was the perfect opportunity to show why the trust are a good idea, not just to Neil Black but to undecided fans like me. Instead it desended into a farce to be honest.
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Robbie Nud
David Clarke
I really do look like this.
Posts: 3,101
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Post by Robbie Nud on Oct 4, 2017 10:58:47 GMT
On both sides? When your chairman lies to the fans about you, do you take it or respond? What is NB and GM scared of?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2017 11:34:35 GMT
If NB said he'd offered to meet in Nottingham at the Q & A, if untrue or not, why not ask him there and then if that offer is still open and put it down to miscommunication as a gesture of goodwill.
You've then got yourself a meeting in Nottingham assuming he says yes, if not then you could have called him out there and then.
Nobody likes to be called a liar but the goals of the trust are a higher priority surely?
A missed opportunity there.
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Post by pingchowchi on Oct 4, 2017 12:03:12 GMT
Exactly, the smart thing would have been to say something along the lines of 'oh we thought your letter indicated that the meeting was in Leicester, now you have clarified it's was Nottingham is the offer still open?' I guess it would have been hard to turn down that offer in front of a pub full of fans.
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Robbie Nud
David Clarke
I really do look like this.
Posts: 3,101
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Post by Robbie Nud on Oct 4, 2017 12:19:52 GMT
Have you read the communication timeline? The letter 'requesting' meeting was via the solicitors acting on behalf of the club at the solicitors office where NB would attend. No mention of a meeting offered by the club.
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Post by pingchowchi on Oct 4, 2017 12:39:26 GMT
Surely having a meeting with neil black is the goal of this though? Yes he wanted his solicitor in attendance, but I thought the sticking point was where the meeting was taking place. At least that's the impression I got for the Q&A last night.
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Robbie Nud
David Clarke
I really do look like this.
Posts: 3,101
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Post by Robbie Nud on Oct 4, 2017 12:59:41 GMT
It wasn't his solicitor, it was the one that was acting on behalf of the club and threatening legal action. The Trust was advised to request a postponement. All this is on the Trusts website.
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Post by pingchowchi on Oct 4, 2017 13:07:48 GMT
OK I'll leave this here, best of luck to you guys in the future.
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No 29
Jade Galbraith
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Post by No 29 on Oct 4, 2017 13:33:16 GMT
Leaving aside the spat about where the meeting at the solicitors was going to be, Leicester or Nottingham, the main message last night was that NB has chosen to engage with fans via these Q+ A sessions and doesn't intend to grant the Trust special status/access.
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Post by sevcik on Oct 4, 2017 14:12:32 GMT
If I'm honest I thoroughly enjoyed the Q & A and thought Neil Black was as open as he could be on the questions asked (I dont know enough about the alleged proposed Neil Black/ Supporters trust meeting No mention of London coming on line at all when someone asked him about proposed new teams.... Even though he's set up a company to run the club... If it ever happens- called Emperor's entertainment I think. So can only assume it's not going to happen in the near future.
I did manage to record it after my failed attempt at the last one. I've listened back to parts of it - though not the best quality it is clear enough to understand.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2017 15:22:10 GMT
Disappointed that the topic of the trust turned into a slagging match of BOTH sides calling each other liars. Walked out at that point. I love the fact that Neil is willing to do a Q&A with fans and hope they continue but not like last night. Neil saying they offered a meeting, the trust saying he’s lying and until we see evidence from either side then I’m not drawn either way. I don’t oppose the trust, I don’t support it either and never will, and whilst I do believe that Panthers haven’t suggested a meeting like the Trust has said, I actually came away being more on Neil Blacks side. What bonus is there to him meeting the Trust? If he does continue his Q&As, maybe get GM involved too, then is that not the dialogue that the Trust is wanting? Or is it “Cardiff have a fan council, why don’t we?”
What stuck with me though was Neil asking “since you’re here then, what suggestions does the trust have?” And there was not 1 suggestion. A response of “you’ve caught us a short notice” kind of baffled me as this Q&A has been on the cards for months. All we get told is “it isn’t suitable for a public Q&A”. Why not? What’s the trust hiding? I’ve seen the timeline of events and can see the frustration, but Neil is talking with fans and accepting suggestions at these Q&As, I see progress there and he’s acting on what he’s said. I don’t see what the Trust can suggest or add? I might just be being stupid, but I don’t get it.
I understood the trust want more dialogue with the fans, why not get these Q&As to be the starting point and develop the relationship. I’m sorry, it just baffles me
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2017 17:37:53 GMT
I understand the Trust taking the advice of SD not to accept the meeting at the clubs solicitors in London but the Trust can't seriously expect to go from no contact to full engagement instantly.
On the road to your end goal you probably will have to speak to some solicitors/NB en route to that goal and last night was a great chance for you to be positive in organising that opening dialogue with him but it sounds like it descended into focussing on what has happened rather than what you want to happen from here.
The more I think of it from the perspective of the club. Last year you set up a group using the clubs name, a similar logo and sold merchandise using that name and logo. Whilst your goal isn't to take away revenue from the club that's an action that would appear to do so to me so I can fully see why the club would want to be tentative in dealing with you.
For me if NB does 2-4 Q&As a year then that's a pretty good amount of fan engagement, he clearly listens to fans at these meeting, plus a much more positive social media presence and what appears to be a growing of ties between the club and TCW again. I'm a lot more happy about the behind the scenes running of our club now than I was this time last year.
If the existence of the trust has contributed to those changes then I thank you but at the same time to me it makes the trust redundant unless the above deteriorates.
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Post by mardibum on Oct 4, 2017 19:29:07 GMT
I remember those hoodies, Stratty, but they didn't take away any Panthers revenue did they? I don't think you could buy them from Panthers. I really think that the fan/club communications have improved no-end since the Trust was formed. I also think that if the Trust ended, then so would communication! Imho, NB is just trying to negate the reasons for the Trusts existence. When that comes to fruition and the Trust folds, it will back to normal, I'm sure.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2017 20:02:46 GMT
I remember those hoodies, Stratty, but they didn't take away any Panthers revenue did they? I don't think you could buy them from Panthers. I really think that the fan/club communications have improved no-end since the Trust was formed. I also think that if the Trust ended, then so would communication! Imho, NB is just trying to negate the reasons for the Trusts existence. When that comes to fruition and the Trust folds, it will back to normal, I'm sure. Panthers sell hoodies, NP supporters trust come along offering a Cheaper Panthers looking hoodie. You can see why Panthers may not take too kindly to that. I believe 100% the intentions of the trust were and are genuine but the approach in some area has to be questioned. If the existence of the trust is keeping Panthers management genuine then fantastic. I just can't see them getting much further than where they are now.
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Post by spik on Oct 4, 2017 20:42:30 GMT
I can't recall much merchandise at all. One hoody which was not of the clubs logo in yellow was sold to members through connection to those people through the Trusts communication links.Not on the premises of the club nor at any of their venues that I understand. I assume anyone from off the street can start up an organisation and sell goods to it's members.I have done this myself with the sport of Gym-Hockey many years ago. Any such use of name etc which was of concern was altered by the Trust in re-branding immediately. Even the colour changed (to Nottingham green now), so the Trust adheared to all requests.
To avoid any confrontation, which is being debated here.I know that the Trusts organisers (interim board members) stated that they would NOT be posing any questions at this general Q+A night.So I assume any questions to NB were from supporters of the club, be them in the Trust or not. More likely members who felt a need to ask.
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