GD31 Panthers 1:6 Flyers / Dec 2 / EL

[Yotes]

Dec 2, 2022 23:11:34 GMT The Flying Shirt said:

CN must be wondering what the hell he has got himself into

He seems quite happy with it judging by the interview. Has anyone checked if any of these teams he's consulted with have improved at all?

[kievthegreat]

Dec 2, 2022 22:00:04 GMT Yotes said:

Dec 2, 2022 21:19:29 GMT kievthegreat said:

A lot of people aren't staying for the third. Why am I such a glutton for punishment?

You're there as Cage reporter. Bad luck.

Can I just drop a link to Flashscores next week? I might give myself the weekend off from the torture and just get waterboarded instead. Seems like it would be more fun.

[spik]

Dec 2, 2022 23:19:43 GMT kievthegreat said:

I'd like some of what Corey's been having. It would make me less angry.

Like I say, after so much losing I'd not be going to the bookies (on a Panthers win) because this is the end result. Nothing bad said about the performance....'this is the starting point'...oh yea? Seems like a final point. On regulation wins we are 8th. Are we not to make the play offs next.

[wgray]

I’ll stand by the opinion that it was the wrong decision to sack Graham, the players signed, the squad balance and an underperforming Brit pack are the issue, as we’re continuing to witness.

The biggest issue we have now is the fact that we’ve already made 17 import signings this season which means we only have 3 left. If I was Neilson I’d be looking to make 3 signings, however I’d also be looking to release multiple players, including Brits, to free up more money to attract the right players

[Mark]

Dec 2, 2022 22:55:13 GMT Discoray said:

Dec 2, 2022 22:28:33 GMT Mark said:

Neil Black has reduced this club his clubs to a shambolic laughing stock.

Fixed that for you.

Thanks mate. Remiss of me to not mention The Clan.

[Bagheera]

Dec 3, 2022 0:18:48 GMT wgray said:

I’ll stand by the opinion that it was the wrong decision to sack Graham, the players signed, the squad balance and an underperforming Brit pack are the issue, as we’re continuing to witness.

The biggest issue we have now is the fact that we’ve already made 17 import signings this season which means we only have 3 left. If I was Neilson I’d be looking to make 3 signings, however I’d also be looking to release multiple players, including Brits, to free up more money to attract the right players

Am I right in thinking Injury reserve cover signings dont count agaisnt your quota? So for example, if Corey managed to bend Lepines ear this weekend he could hang around for a month and not impact the 3 signings we have left.

[iginla]

Dec 2, 2022 23:19:43 GMT kievthegreat said:

I'd like some of what Corey's been having. It would make me less angry.

Yep.
That interview in both what he says and the way he acts is exactly why Corey Neilson totally naffs me off big time !

[Mark]

Dec 3, 2022 0:22:58 GMT Mark said:

Dec 2, 2022 22:55:13 GMT Discoray said:

Fixed that for you.

Thanks mate. Remiss of me to not mention The Clan.

[wgray]

Dec 3, 2022 0:28:06 GMT Bagheera said:

Dec 3, 2022 0:18:48 GMT wgray said:

I’ll stand by the opinion that it was the wrong decision to sack Graham, the players signed, the squad balance and an underperforming Brit pack are the issue, as we’re continuing to witness.

The biggest issue we have now is the fact that we’ve already made 17 import signings this season which means we only have 3 left. If I was Neilson I’d be looking to make 3 signings, however I’d also be looking to release multiple players, including Brits, to free up more money to attract the right players

Am I right in thinking Injury reserve cover signings dont count agaisnt your quota? So for example, if Corey managed to bend Lepines ear this weekend he could hang around for a month and not impact the 3 signings we have left.

Yes that’s correct, and I agree with you regards Lepine. However, I’m praying we’ve already got a defenceman lined up

[Robbie Nud]

Six losses in a row now. That was dire, first period was reasonable, lots of pace and energy, although there seemed to be some confusion as to what colour we weee playing in. Second and third periods were true to form, ran out of energy and interest for some. Fife had a lead and could have sat back and shot on net at a distance, oh wait, they did shoot from a distance and scored!
Why did they leave Dubeau in goal? He should have been pulled part way through the 2nd, not with just 1 minute 4 seconds left.

There are some players who put the effort in , although with a team where all the forwards are supposed to be high scorers there is no back up. Ferrara, Hammond and Brady look to be 3 very expensive mistakes. It is a pity we only have a few signing slots left, because there is about half the team that want canning.

Was looking round at the crowd, was more interesting than what was on the ice, and the thought of ‘good seats still available’ sprang to mind, because there was hundreds of them to be seen. And it comes to something when the biggest cheer of the night and prolonged applause was for the loan fife fan. But that sums about it all up.

So we dropped from 6th to 7th tonight and the way things are going could be 8th by the end of the day.

[ashfieldpanther]

And strangely I don't disagree with most of what CN said. The effort was there,the transition was there, the passing at times was crisp. We were let down by a couple of bad bounces, deflections, a very night from Dubeau and a reminder that good goalies are hard to find so you hang on to one when you've got him. Owen had a very good night, don't say we kept shooting at him cos that is good positioning. BUT, the same players keep starting the game then disappearing - Brady, Puffer, Anderson, Sorensen, where do they go.? At least Hammond is trying to do something, just not very well at the moment. But we have to keep going.

[bobness]

You do wonder if at any other team the league, a line of Hammond, Brady and Ferrara would be scoring for fun? That said, it looks a bit unbalanced, the kind of line you send out as PP1, not a regular one.
Their combined +/- must be pretty rank since they've been together, hell, even iggy is telling us how bad it is.
A third of the way into the season, and the team is still experimenting with line combinations.

[Bagheera]

Dec 3, 2022 7:56:49 GMT ashfieldpanther said:

And strangely I don't disagree with most of what CN said. The effort was there,the transition was there, the passing at times was crisp. We were let down by a couple of bad bounces, deflections, a very night from Dubeau and a reminder that good goalies are hard to find so you hang on to one when you've got him. Owen had a very good night, don't say we kept shooting at him cos that is good positioning. BUT, the same players keep starting the game then disappearing - Brady, Puffer, Anderson, Sorensen, where do they go.? At least Hammond is trying to do something, just not very well at the moment. But we have to keep going.

I think I largely agree to. I dont think lack of effort came in to it. Lack of confidence and lack of quality absoloutly. In many respects it was an old school type game vs Fife. Outshoot them 2 to 1 with their goalie being outstanding. They usually finish 2 1 to the road team. If Debeau didn't stink the place out it would've been much closer.

To be honest I saw more of what I want to see from Sorensen towards the end, and a few others. It's a shame it took being out of the game and them getting stroppy to see it. If we played with that bit of a chirpy edge to start a game it may make an actual difference.

[bobness]

9/90/19 are a combined -32 since the start of November.
Hammond alone is -16 in that time. (7 games)
I'm no genius, but surely someone at Panthers has noticed that?

[chucka1]

There is a groundswell of opinion on here that some player changes are needed, as well as any improvements a change in coaching may make. In addition to the limit on signings, could the Panthers poor position hamper the Panthers chances of getting any quality? Going back over the years there have been mid (or late!) season changes that have made a difference to a 4/5 place side, but will players want to come to a 7/8 place team?

[iginla]

Dec 3, 2022 8:23:48 GMT bobness said:

9/90/19 are a combined -32 since the start of November.
Hammond alone is -16 in that time. (7 games)
I'm no genius, but surely someone at Panthers has noticed that?

Good lord, I knew it had to be bad and that’s why I pointed it out but those stats are shocking.
That just smacks of a first/second line that has three players who are all either as lazy as hell or completely lacking defensively.
Probably also why Hammond has never been taken by one of the leagues big three teams as their coaches can see the failings.
Interestingly, all three have Pacha’s fingerprints all over them !

[PantherG]

Dec 3, 2022 10:24:21 GMT iginla said:

Dec 3, 2022 8:23:48 GMT bobness said:

9/90/19 are a combined -32 since the start of November.
Hammond alone is -16 in that time. (7 games)
I'm no genius, but surely someone at Panthers has noticed that?

Good lord, I knew it had to be bad and that’s why I pointed it out but those stats are shocking.
That just smacks of a first/second line that has three players who are all either as lazy as hell or completely lacking defensively.
Probably also why Hammond has never been taken by one of the leagues big three teams as their coaches can see the failings.
Interestingly, all three have Pacha’s fingerprints all over them !

I’m sorry, I know you’re enjoying this atm but throw dirt where it’s warranted. Ferreira and Hammond were good signings by Pacha/GG and everyone on here was excited, so to be critical of those signings makes you look bitter. Yeah, it seems they’re not playing well, but their track records didn’t suggest they were poor signings. I’m sure if they were a few miles up the M1 they’d be scoring for fun.

I stopped going to the games, but I don’t come on here every 5 mins gloating, every time the team lose, you enjoy it way too much and I’m not sure what made you so bitter.

[iginla]

Dec 3, 2022 11:34:57 GMT PantherG said:

Dec 3, 2022 10:24:21 GMT iginla said:

Good lord, I knew it had to be bad and that’s why I pointed it out but those stats are shocking.
That just smacks of a first/second line that has three players who are all either as lazy as hell or completely lacking defensively.
Probably also why Hammond has never been taken by one of the leagues big three teams as their coaches can see the failings.
Interestingly, all three have Pacha’s fingerprints all over them !

I’m sorry, I know you’re enjoying this atm but throw dirt where it’s warranted. Ferreira and Hammond were good signings by Pacha/GG and everyone on here was excited, so to be critical of those signings makes you look bitter. Yeah, it seems they’re not playing well, but their track records didn’t suggest they were poor signings. I’m sure if they were a few miles up the M1 they’d be scoring for fun.

I stopped going to the games, but I don’t come on here every 5 mins gloating, every time the team lose, you enjoy it way too much and I’m not sure what made you so bitter.

Just pointing out facts,their current stats are terrible and they all look like Pacha signings. If this team was in Sheffield or Cardiff half a dozen of them would be long gone by now.
What else is there to say about this team other than negative,they deserve all the criticism they get, or the club could just do what they always do and just try and hide behind all the usual excuses that we’ve heard for the last ten years.
This team needs a good hard public kick up the backside but have we seen it...not a chance.
Last time we really saw anybody take any responsibility for poor performance was 12/13 when Jordan Fox stood up after a home defeat to a very poor 12 man Edinburgh team and said “that isn’t happening again”.
And look what happened next !
As for my reasons,I’ve documented some of those before, some performance related and some off ice issues, but at the end of the day everybody has their own opinions of the club and this is a forum for discussion and opinions.

[ashfieldpanther]

Going out on a limb here, but could a reason for the lack of goals from the forwards be that they've had success previously on smaller, tighter rinks (manchester, coventry) and they aren't suited to the wider and better ice pad at Nottingham? No stats to back up but certainly Brady, Hammond and Ferrara would fit that category. Discuss.

[Discoray]

Dec 3, 2022 12:23:53 GMT ashfieldpanther said:

Going out on a limb here, but could a reason for the lack of goals from the forwards be that they've had success previously on smaller, tighter rinks (manchester, coventry) and they aren't suited to the wider and better ice pad at Nottingham? No stats to back up but certainly Brady, Hammond and Ferrara would fit that category. Discuss.

Can only speak to Hammond, he tore it up at the Clan when he first came into the EIHL, and Braehead is an Olympic sized pad. Most players these days are used to playing between both rink sizes, so I don't think it's the factor it once used to be. Hammond also shown himself to be one of GB's better players for their stint in the top-tier, and that's all played on the larger pad as well.

Like the Clan, I think there's just too much wrong in your team makeup/chemistry combined with the lack of confidence, that's seeing even things that *should* work, not work at all.

[The Flying Shirt]

Dec 3, 2022 12:23:53 GMT ashfieldpanther said:

Going out on a limb here, but could a reason for the lack of goals from the forwards be that they've had success previously on smaller, tighter rinks (manchester, coventry) and they aren't suited to the wider and better ice pad at Nottingham? No stats to back up but certainly Brady, Hammond and Ferrara would fit that category. Discuss.

The reason is that players play as lines and unless you are going to take the entire line or very similar that he's scoring for fun on then stats are just the luck of the draw.

Graham and Ling = Killer amount of goals.

Graham by himself = Hardly any goals.

Player stats are good for stats sake but meaningless unless a player is clicking on a line.

[Bagheera]

Dec 3, 2022 12:23:53 GMT ashfieldpanther said:

Going out on a limb here, but could a reason for the lack of goals from the forwards be that they've had success previously on smaller, tighter rinks (manchester, coventry) and they aren't suited to the wider and better ice pad at Nottingham? No stats to back up but certainly Brady, Hammond and Ferrara would fit that category. Discuss.

It's an all to familiar tail of some of these kind of players moving from a smaller budget team to Nottingham in particular. I dont really know the reasons. Some will certainly come down to treatment and engagement. The main reason I believe is the way the smaller teams build a roster. They stack the top line and expect them to log huge minutes. They work hard to ensure they have all the peices for a succesful top line. A good supporting 2nd too. They are prepared to sacrifice their bottom end to ensure the top end can give them soemthing to get behind. Often they dont even role 4 lines.
Coming to Panthers. Certainly the last few years they appear to be signed as an overall group and then its worked out how to best fit the peices together.

A top line centre almost guarenteed the same lines mates all season logging 30 minutes a night = big points.

[bobness]

Id not expect any forwards to log 30 minutes a night.
25 if you’re riding them hard.
Your gun D man may get 25+, but not many much more.

9/90/19 should be high scoring, but something’s not clicking at all.
9/90/94 looked top notch early doors, but has been split up ever since.

[Bagheera]

Dec 3, 2022 15:16:07 GMT bobness said:

Id not expect any forwards to log 30 minutes a night.
25 if you’re riding them hard.
Your gun D man may get 25+, but not many much more.

9/90/19 should be high scoring, but something’s not clicking at all.
9/90/94 looked top notch early doors, but has been split up ever since.

Fair that. It is usually the stud D men that log the big minutes isn't it. Anyway. Im sure you get the point i'm making. Those top lines on the smaller teams log significantly more minutes than on a bigger(cough, cough) team.

[spik]

Dec 3, 2022 14:26:56 GMT The Flying Shirt said:

Dec 3, 2022 12:23:53 GMT ashfieldpanther said:

Going out on a limb here, but could a reason for the lack of goals from the forwards be that they've had success previously on smaller, tighter rinks (manchester, coventry) and they aren't suited to the wider and better ice pad at Nottingham? No stats to back up but certainly Brady, Hammond and Ferrara would fit that category. Discuss.

The reason is that players play as lines and unless you are going to take the entire line or very similar that he's scoring for fun on then stats are just the luck of the draw.

Graham and Ling = Killer amount of goals.

Graham by himself = Hardly any goals.

Player stats are good for stats sake but meaningless unless a player is clicking on a line.

Indeed, Graham chosen in an all-star team too. Would he have been otherwise.