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Post by blackandgold73 on Jun 23, 2022 19:53:02 GMT
Nice find. Thanks for sharing that Sevcik. Looks like he'll tick those community boxes as well that GG is big, on as well as his on ice product looking very promising
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Adi
Pat Casey
Posts: 340
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Post by Adi on Jun 23, 2022 20:00:42 GMT
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Post by jd on Jun 23, 2022 20:10:06 GMT
Absolutely zero, Panthers are now a very closed shop. Much as they were last Summer actually. Fair enough! I’d love a proper face off winner centre, like Tessier Blimey I’ll take that! Nice signing. Nothing to moan about here
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Pies
Forum Moderator
Reluctant Chief of ITK
Posts: 4,879
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Post by Pies on Jun 24, 2022 4:45:37 GMT
Sorenson is exactly the sort of player we should be going for. Consistent points output at a similar level, experienced but not overly old. He looks like a heck of a pick up for us. Him and Ferrara are 2 legit 20+ goal scorers added to this roster.
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Post by PantherTom on Jun 24, 2022 7:36:45 GMT
Very impressed with the recruitment so far! I would like a solid Goaltender and a Mean D-man next like a Louis type
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,484
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Post by iginla on Jun 24, 2022 8:04:32 GMT
Sorenson is exactly the sort of player we should be going for. Consistent points output at a similar level, experienced but not overly old. He looks like a heck of a pick up for us. Him and Ferrara are 2 legit 20+ goal scorers added to this roster. Yes true. The 2nd line is stacking up quite nicely.
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Post by bobness on Jun 24, 2022 8:54:38 GMT
Sorenson is exactly the sort of player we should be going for. Consistent points output at a similar level, experienced but not overly old. He looks like a heck of a pick up for us. Him and Ferrara are 2 legit 20+ goal scorers added to this roster. Yes true. The 2nd line is stacking up quite nicely. And there it is. One assumes you thus have Welsh as the first line centre? If not, what makes you think that Sorenson isn't a "first line" player? ECHL stats wise, he's way (20+%) ahead of Piccinich and Conway, and they weren't bad. I'll be very surprised if he and Welsh aren't the top 2 centres come September. If Panthers do sign someone "better", they'll have 3 of the best centres in the league.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2022 9:04:17 GMT
Yes true. The 2nd line is stacking up quite nicely. And there it is. One assumes you thus have Welsh as the first line centre? If not, what makes you think that Sorenson isn't a "first line" player? ECHL stats wise, he's way (20+%) ahead of Piccinich and Conway, and they weren't bad. I'll be very surprised if he and Welsh aren't the top 2 centres come September. If Panthers do sign someone "better", they'll have 3 of the best centres in the league. I've done a bit of further digging/stats retrieval. Last season there were 24 20+ goal scorers in the EIHL Regular Season across all 10 teams. Sheffield had the most with 4, Fife the least with 1. Everyone else had either 2 or 3 20+ goal scorers on their roster (for the record, Panthers had 2, Boivin & Baillargeon). If we are to assume that Sorenson & Ferrara are on the 2nd line as potential 20+ goal scorers, we should also assume that all three first line forwards would also be 20+ goal scorers. Therefore you are looking at your entire first & second line forwards scoring 20+ goals each. Not impossible, but a tad unrealistic based on the statistics above.
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,484
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Post by iginla on Jun 24, 2022 9:13:39 GMT
Yes true. The 2nd line is stacking up quite nicely. And there it is. One assumes you thus have Welsh as the first line centre? If not, what makes you think that Sorenson isn't a "first line" player? ECHL stats wise, he's way (20+%) ahead of Piccinich and Conway, and they weren't bad. I'll be very surprised if he and Welsh aren't the top 2 centres come September. If Panthers do sign someone "better", they'll have 3 of the best centres in the league. And there you are,Iggy posts something positive and somebody immediately looks for the negative. How do you know that I don’t have Welch and Ferrara on the 2nd line (as they previously played together) and Sorensen on the first line ?
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,484
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Post by iginla on Jun 24, 2022 9:17:55 GMT
And there it is. One assumes you thus have Welsh as the first line centre? If not, what makes you think that Sorenson isn't a "first line" player? ECHL stats wise, he's way (20+%) ahead of Piccinich and Conway, and they weren't bad. I'll be very surprised if he and Welsh aren't the top 2 centres come September. If Panthers do sign someone "better", they'll have 3 of the best centres in the league. I've done a bit of further digging/stats retrieval. Last season there were 24 20+ goal scorers in the EIHL Regular Season across all 10 teams. Sheffield had the most with 4, Fife the least with 1. Everyone else had either 2 or 3 20+ goal scorers on their roster (for the record, Panthers had 2, Boivin & Baillargeon). If we are to assume that Sorenson & Ferrara are on the 2nd line as potential 20+ goal scorers, we should also assume that all three first line forwards would also be 20+ goal scorers. Therefore you are looking at your entire first & second line forwards scoring 20+ goals each. Not impossible, but a tad unrealistic based on the statistics above. Why should we automatically assume all three first liners HAVE to be 20 plus goal scorers ? Not everybody is or has to be a goal scorer there are other facets to a successful line,even a first line.
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Post by blackandgold73 on Jun 24, 2022 9:27:43 GMT
And there it is. One assumes you thus have Welsh as the first line centre? If not, what makes you think that Sorenson isn't a "first line" player? ECHL stats wise, he's way (20+%) ahead of Piccinich and Conway, and they weren't bad. I'll be very surprised if he and Welsh aren't the top 2 centres come September. If Panthers do sign someone "better", they'll have 3 of the best centres in the league. I've done a bit of further digging/stats retrieval. Last season there were 24 20+ goal scorers in the EIHL Regular Season across all 10 teams. Sheffield had the most with 4, Fife the least with 1. Everyone else had either 2 or 3 20+ goal scorers on their roster (for the record, Panthers had 2, Boivin & Baillargeon). If we are to assume that Sorenson & Ferrara are on the 2nd line as potential 20+ goal scorers, we should also assume that all three first line forwards would also be 20+ goal scorers. Therefore you are looking at your entire first & second line forwards scoring 20+ goals each. Not impossible, but a tad unrealistic based on the statistics above. Would be nice if we did though because the last time we had that was 12-13 (Ling, Graham, Clarke, Francis, Gallivan) and that worked out alright. But we only *just* made it to five that year. But as you've demonstrated having the most 20+ goal scorers doesn't guarantee you success either (Sheffield last year). Belfast only had three last year, but crucially another 6 players on between 13-18. So clearly scoring depth is required but the real key is going to be a truly stingy defence. It's what set Belfast apart from the other free scoring teams. And we definitely didn't have a tight defence last year. Only Storm shipped now goals than we did. We shipped as many goals as Fife who propped up the League, and across 54 games only scored 41 more goals than them, so that shows how close our season game to being much much worse.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2022 9:29:49 GMT
I've done a bit of further digging/stats retrieval. Last season there were 24 20+ goal scorers in the EIHL Regular Season across all 10 teams. Sheffield had the most with 4, Fife the least with 1. Everyone else had either 2 or 3 20+ goal scorers on their roster (for the record, Panthers had 2, Boivin & Baillargeon). If we are to assume that Sorenson & Ferrara are on the 2nd line as potential 20+ goal scorers, we should also assume that all three first line forwards would also be 20+ goal scorers. Therefore you are looking at your entire first & second line forwards scoring 20+ goals each. Not impossible, but a tad unrealistic based on the statistics above. Would be nice if we did though because the last time we had that was 12-13 (Ling, Graham, Clarke, Francis, Gallivan) and that worked out alright. But we only *just* made it to five that year. But as you've demonstrated having the most 20+ goal scorers doesn't guarantee you success either (Sheffield last year). Belfast only had three last year, but crucially another 6 players on between 13-18. So clearly scoring depth is required but the real key is going to be a truly stingy defence. It's what set Belfast apart from the other free scoring teams. And we definitely didn't have a tight defence last year. Only Storm shipped now goals than we did. We shipped as many goals as Fife who propped up the League, and across 54 games only scored 41 more goals than them, so that shows how close our season game to being much much worse. A perfect illustration of the phrase 'goals win game, defence wins championships.'
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Post by blackandgold73 on Jun 24, 2022 9:38:48 GMT
And there it is. One assumes you thus have Welsh as the first line centre? If not, what makes you think that Sorenson isn't a "first line" player? ECHL stats wise, he's way (20+%) ahead of Piccinich and Conway, and they weren't bad. I'll be very surprised if he and Welsh aren't the top 2 centres come September. If Panthers do sign someone "better", they'll have 3 of the best centres in the league. And there you are,Iggy posts something positive and somebody immediately looks for the negative. How do you know that I don’t have Welch and Ferrara on the 2nd line (as they previously played together) and Sorensen on the first line ? Iggy, there's nothing negative about bobness's post. He's just asking/discussing your thinking about it. He said he was "assuming" you had Welsh first line. This gives you an opportunity to respond and say why you think he'll be second line. He's literally admitted he doesn't know if you've got Welsh on the first or second line He asks why you don't think Sorenson is first line. He says why he thinks he potentially would be. This is your opportunity to explain why you think not. Asking you to explain your thinking is how a discussion works. It's your opportunity to convince others. Bobness laid out his thinking trying to convince you. Now you can do the same. Disagreeing with you is not automatically being negative (unless you Boris Johnson it seems). Neither is anyone here an absolute monarch who's word is law. That's the beauty of a forum, the discussion. Everyone's view is equally valid when they can make the case in support of it So, that said, why not make your case.
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Post by blackandgold73 on Jun 24, 2022 9:39:35 GMT
Would be nice if we did though because the last time we had that was 12-13 (Ling, Graham, Clarke, Francis, Gallivan) and that worked out alright. But we only *just* made it to five that year. But as you've demonstrated having the most 20+ goal scorers doesn't guarantee you success either (Sheffield last year). Belfast only had three last year, but crucially another 6 players on between 13-18. So clearly scoring depth is required but the real key is going to be a truly stingy defence. It's what set Belfast apart from the other free scoring teams. And we definitely didn't have a tight defence last year. Only Storm shipped now goals than we did. We shipped as many goals as Fife who propped up the League, and across 54 games only scored 41 more goals than them, so that shows how close our season game to being much much worse. A perfect illustration of the phrase 'goals win game, defence wins championships.' That was my take away from it too. Glad you found it useful
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Post by blackandgold73 on Jun 24, 2022 9:41:34 GMT
I've done a bit of further digging/stats retrieval. Last season there were 24 20+ goal scorers in the EIHL Regular Season across all 10 teams. Sheffield had the most with 4, Fife the least with 1. Everyone else had either 2 or 3 20+ goal scorers on their roster (for the record, Panthers had 2, Boivin & Baillargeon). If we are to assume that Sorenson & Ferrara are on the 2nd line as potential 20+ goal scorers, we should also assume that all three first line forwards would also be 20+ goal scorers. Therefore you are looking at your entire first & second line forwards scoring 20+ goals each. Not impossible, but a tad unrealistic based on the statistics above. Why should we automatically assume all three first liners HAVE to be 20 plus goal scorers ? Not everybody is or has to be a goal scorer there are other facets to a successful line,even a first line. There are yes. What would you say they are? GG had given his view on it in the podcasts and he clearly is looking for three different types on a line. What would you say makes a good mix on a line?
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,484
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Post by iginla on Jun 24, 2022 9:49:55 GMT
Why should we automatically assume all three first liners HAVE to be 20 plus goal scorers ? Not everybody is or has to be a goal scorer there are other facets to a successful line,even a first line. There are yes. What would you say they are? GG had given his view on it in the podcasts and he clearly is looking for three different types on a line. What would you say makes a good mix on a line? A good line is exactly like Ling,Graham and Benedict. One wins the puck,one passes it and the other one scores the goals.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2022 9:57:52 GMT
I actually think Sorenson will be 1C . Can see Graham starting Ferrara and Welsh together on the 2nd line ... Get two decent sized wingers either side of Sorenson I'll be happy
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,484
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Post by iginla on Jun 24, 2022 10:05:08 GMT
And there you are,Iggy posts something positive and somebody immediately looks for the negative. How do you know that I don’t have Welch and Ferrara on the 2nd line (as they previously played together) and Sorensen on the first line ? Iggy, there's nothing negative about bobness's post. He's just asking/discussing your thinking about it. He said he was "assuming" you had Welsh first line. This gives you an opportunity to respond and say why you think he'll be second line. He's literally admitted he doesn't know if you've got Welsh on the first or second line He asks why you don't think Sorenson is first line. He says why he thinks he potentially would be. This is your opportunity to explain why you think not. Asking you to explain your thinking is how a discussion works. It's your opportunity to convince others. Bobness laid out his thinking trying to convince you. Now you can do the same. Disagreeing with you is not automatically being negative (unless you Boris Johnson it seems). Neither is anyone here an absolute monarch who's word is law. That's the beauty of a forum, the discussion. Everyone's view is equally valid when they can make the case in support of it So, that said, why not make your case. There is,he said “what makes me think Sorensen isn’t a first line player”. I didn’t say that. Either Sorensen or Welsh could play first line as long as they’re slotted in with two top end players. That leaves the other one with Ferrara on the second line plus another good player and you’ve got the makings of a decent team. As long as he signs a defence along the lines of Beckett, Werner,Lepine and Fox in other words pairings with a tough stay home guy along with an equally solid playmaker.,plus a good goalie. Plus a fifth D of maybe utility ability. The third line can be Myers and a couple of half decent imports and the fourth line is whatever kids they have plus a tough guy.
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Post by blackandgold73 on Jun 24, 2022 10:08:22 GMT
There are yes. What would you say they are? GG had given his view on it in the podcasts and he clearly is looking for three different types on a line. What would you say makes a good mix on a line? A good line is exactly like Ling,Graham and Benedict. One wins the puck,one passes it and the other one scores the goals. GG was saying he likes one player who's actions create space for the other two (essentially tying up at least two of the opposition), a speed merchant and an out and out goal scorer. From what I remember. But someone can correct that if I'm misremembering. Was back in the first podcast
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Post by blackandgold73 on Jun 24, 2022 10:22:34 GMT
Iggy, there's nothing negative about bobness's post. He's just asking/discussing your thinking about it. He said he was "assuming" you had Welsh first line. This gives you an opportunity to respond and say why you think he'll be second line. He's literally admitted he doesn't know if you've got Welsh on the first or second line He asks why you don't think Sorenson is first line. He says why he thinks he potentially would be. This is your opportunity to explain why you think not. Asking you to explain your thinking is how a discussion works. It's your opportunity to convince others. Bobness laid out his thinking trying to convince you. Now you can do the same. Disagreeing with you is not automatically being negative (unless you Boris Johnson it seems). Neither is anyone here an absolute monarch who's word is law. That's the beauty of a forum, the discussion. Everyone's view is equally valid when they can make the case in support of it So, that said, why not make your case. There is,he said “what makes me think Sorensen isn’t a first line player”. I didn’t say that. Either Sorensen or Welsh could play first line as long as they’re slotted in with two top end players. That leaves the other one with Ferrara on the second line plus another good player and you’ve got the makings of a decent team. As long as he signs a defence along the lines of Beckett, Werner,Lepine and Fox in other words pairings with a tough stay home guy along with an equally solid playmaker.,plus a good goalie. Plus a fifth D of maybe utility ability. The third line can be Myers and a couple of half decent imports and the fourth line is whatever kids they have plus a tough guy. And he never says you did say that. Your quote is inherently more negative because you you've chosen to omit the question mark, the first two words and the preceding line. The "if not" is crucial. It makes it a question. Not too mention the question mark which you've removed from the sentence. Your quoting makes it seem like a passive aggressive statement, that was never made, not a question The full quote is: "One *assumes* you thus have Welsh as the first line centre? *If not*, what makes you think that Sorenson isn't a "first line" player*?*" Suddenly it becomes just a question again, one that you've just answered, and answered well, explaining your reasoning and that either could play first or second line 😊 That's all the original poster was asking Think GG and Pacha are planning on going 6D (from what I remember?) but yes your plan for that kind of team is well argued and the one extra player on the roster gives them a fourth line capability again.
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yeti
Robert Lachowicz
Posts: 456
Member is Online
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Post by yeti on Jun 24, 2022 10:44:12 GMT
So the 12-13 season we had two 20+ goal scorers on the first line, two on the second line and one on the third line. Probably the best spread you can hope for in a team. We also had six D as Beckett partnered Weaver not Werner. Werner Partnered Lepine and Fox Partnered Lee I do believe. So each pairing had an offensive D man and a stay at home D man. Also the perfect mix. All backed up with a championship winning goalie. Sign a team like that and we will all be happy. Although I would also accept a third line without a 20+ goal scorer if it was like the Jansen, Farmer, Lawrence line.
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Jord v4
Ken Westman
Harbinger of Doom
Posts: 2,714
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Post by Jord v4 on Jun 24, 2022 10:46:59 GMT
There are yes. What would you say they are? GG had given his view on it in the podcasts and he clearly is looking for three different types on a line. What would you say makes a good mix on a line? A good line is exactly like Ling,Graham and Benedict. One wins the puck,one passes it and the other one scores the goals. This. The best line I've seen at Panthers. Playmaker, sniper & grinder working perfectly together. Was a real sight to behold. Graham absolutely reveled on it.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2022 10:58:45 GMT
A good line is exactly like Ling,Graham and Benedict. One wins the puck,one passes it and the other one scores the goals. This. The best line I've seen at Panthers. Playmaker, sniper & grinder working perfectly together. Was a real sight to behold. Graham absolutely reveled on it. Certainly the best panthers line since moving to the NIC...
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Post by bobness on Jun 24, 2022 11:15:34 GMT
And there it is. One assumes you thus have Welsh as the first line centre? If not, what makes you think that Sorenson isn't a "first line" player? ECHL stats wise, he's way (20+%) ahead of Piccinich and Conway, and they weren't bad. I'll be very surprised if he and Welsh aren't the top 2 centres come September. If Panthers do sign someone "better", they'll have 3 of the best centres in the league. And there you are,Iggy posts something positive and somebody immediately looks for the negative. How do you know that I don’t have Welch and Ferrara on the 2nd line (as they previously played together) and Sorensen on the first line ? Your original "second line stacking up nicely" line is a direct reply to a quote about Sorenson and Ferrara. Thus, I assumed you had those 2 nailed on for second line duties. That's not exactly wild thinking is it? As others have said, you can always counter that's not what you are thinking, and explain why not. Anyhoo... One thing I'd not twigged is that Welsh and Ferrara have played on the same line before, in Poland (with Taylor Doherty also). What I'm not sure is how long for, and how successfully, and even if that is going to be replicated next season. What I am quite sure on (notwithstanding the crap shoot of "Ooh, his stats look good") is that I like the look of Sorenson.
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Post by bobness on Jun 24, 2022 11:16:33 GMT
A good line is exactly like Ling,Graham and Benedict. One wins the puck,one passes it and the other one scores the goals. This. The best line I've seen at Panthers. Playmaker, sniper & grinder working perfectly together. Was a real sight to behold. Graham absolutely reveled on it. Amen to that. A thing of beauty, that line. Can I add Adey, Hadden, Zukiwsky?
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