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Post by ashfieldpanther on May 18, 2021 6:10:29 GMT
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Post by Walitzer on May 18, 2021 10:20:38 GMT
It's a step-up from the EIHL, but a big step or two short of the NHL.
Patrik Berglund and Oliver Ekman-Larsson both went straight into the NHL from Allsvenskan, however I believe they were both 19 at the time, while Kirk is a couple years older at 21 entering the Swedish league. Berglund as a comparison to Kirk, both being forwards atleast, scored over a point-per-game to earn a contract in the big league.
So if Kirk keeps progressing into an absolute goal scoring machine, then theres a small chance at being offered a contract by the Yotes next season. I may be mistaken, but I believe Coyotes have his rights until the end of next year.
On the assumption that he performs very well, I'd guess a slightly more likely entry point to the NHL would have to be to playing the 22-23 season in league on the level of the SHL or DEL, standing out and earning a chance through free-agency. |
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Post by ashfieldpanther on May 18, 2021 11:56:13 GMT
Normally players are set on a path, so even if they play Allsvenskan for a year or two, it will be to gain experience before going on to a contract in the NHL. If Kirk goes to Allsvenskan he's going to have to do very well in this shop window to attract interest.
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Post by floridadad on May 18, 2021 12:08:27 GMT
That league is an extremely defensive league. Forwards need to play both ends of the ice. Kirk is an outstanding talent offensively but in the games I watched him play he is not very sound defensively. That could be a reason why the Coyotes think playing there will help round out his game.
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Post by Walitzer on May 18, 2021 12:58:01 GMT
Normally players are set on a path, so even if they play Allsvenskan for a year or two, it will be to gain experience before going on to a contract in the NHL. If Kirk goes to Allsvenskan he's going to have to do very well in this shop window to attract interest. As far as I understand, unless Kirk has a hell of a year and earns an entry-level contract, that set path expires at the end of next season when the Yote's lose his player rights and he enters free agency.
Were he to be signed, I'd imagine he'd continue to play in Sweden or another high-level league to develop before having a shot at the NHL. |
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Post by pantherlee on May 18, 2021 13:18:13 GMT
I honestly don't think Kirk will get to the NHL, but i can see him performing SHL/AHL/NLA/DEL for many years in his prime. That would still be a big achievement for a Britsh player
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langer
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Post by langer on May 19, 2021 13:30:04 GMT
Too much hype based on nationality over a 7th round NHL pick.
Kirk wasn't among the five best forwards with Peterborough Petes in his last season. One is in the NHL, two played in the AHL, another KHL/AHL and a 18 year old who put up 19 points in 18 games in Swiss second level who'll be a first round pick in the July NHL draft.
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Post by ashfieldpanther on Jun 1, 2021 19:42:33 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2021 10:20:09 GMT
Yup and I can see their logic.. Kirk as things stand is a flash in the pan talent for GB standards.. until they are producing 10 of him per year teams in this case in the NLA will be reluctant to take him on especially from where he's from if teams in Switzerland are hesitant there's no chance teams from the SHL will entertain him. Like I've said before Kirks best bet is to carve out a career as a bottom 6 forward in the AHL as long as he's prepared to spend the next 10+ years away over the pond |
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Post by bobness on Jun 2, 2021 11:18:54 GMT
Yup and I can see their logic.. Kirk as things stand is a flash in the pan talent for GB standards.. until they are producing 10 of him per year teams in this case in the NLA will be reluctant to take him on especially from where he's from if teams in Switzerland are hesitant there's no chance teams from the SHL will entertain him. Like I've said before Kirks best bet is to carve out a career as a bottom 6 forward in the AHL as long as he's prepared to spend the next 10+ years away over the pond Could just be a ploy to talk his price down? If you're really not interested, why say anything at all? |
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Post by Bagheera on Jun 2, 2021 11:32:38 GMT
The statement I think is a little lost in transaltion, or at least I hope so. I'd hazzard a guess that the point he was trying to make was along the lines of.
We only have 5 import spaces. If we take Kirk and it doesn't work out it's going to be a bit embarresing.
Basically that taking an import from a not so recognised nation with in itself be a risk should they not produce at the level expected. Taking a Canadian you know it may end up a bit hit and miss, but you took 1 in 1,000s not 1 of only a few.
Doesn't come across well regardless and it's rightly not gone down well.
The Kirk hype does make me chuckle some what. I really hope he does go on and make the NHL it'd be great to see. If that is going to happen though it isn't going to be next season. He is an exceptional talent against whats on these shores, he's had an exceptional wprlds up against some of the elite, but he isn't an elite talent right now that means he walks into an NHL team. Plenty of educated UK fans get that, but there are also plenty of very silly comments on social media by some I can only assume are less knowledgable. Calls a plenty for him to go straight into the NHL. 🤣
So many people tagging the Coyotes on twitter so they look at what he's doing, like an NHL team doesn't have people watching the worlds anyway and tracking one of their own options. 🙈
I dont think it's beyond the rhelms that he geta picked on some sort of entry level contract and put in the minors though. His stock will now be very high and he needs to take advantage, either in NA or a very good European league.
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Post by ashfieldpanther on Jun 2, 2021 11:48:34 GMT
The statement I think is a little lost in transaltion, or at least I hope so. I'd hazzard a guess that the point he was trying to make was along the lines of. We only have 5 import spaces. If we take Kirk and it doesn't work out it's going to be a bit embarresing. Basically that taking an import from a not so recognised nation with in itself be a risk should they not produce at the level expected. Taking a Canadian you know it may end up a bit hit and miss, but you took 1 in 1,000s not 1 of only a few. Doesn't come across well regardless and it's rightly not gone down well. The Kirk hype does make me chuckle some what. I really hope he does go on and make the NHL it'd be great to see. If that is going to happen though it isn't going to be next season. He is an exceptional talent against whats on these shores, he's had an exceptional wprlds up against some of the elite, but he isn't an elite talent right now that means he walks into an NHL team. Plenty of educated UK fans get that, but there are also plenty of very silly comments on social media by some I can only assume are less knowledgable. Calls a plenty for him to go straight into the NHL. 🤣 So many people tagging the Coyotes on twitter so they look at what he's doing, like an NHL team doesn't have people watching the worlds anyway and tracking one of their own options. 🙈 I dont think it's beyond the rhelms that he geta picked on some sort of entry level contract and put in the minors though. His stock will now be very high and he needs to take advantage, either in NA or a very good European league. General opinion of what I've seen written across the pond or on IIHF site does confirm that his best bet is taking little steps, either going direct to (for example) Sweden for further development, or getting an AHL contract. The only drawback about being in North America is that he could get bounced around, have a good couple of weeks and he might get moved up, have a bad couple of weeks and he gets sent down. It's fairly brutal, having followed the ECHL daily feeds of player comings and goings. That wouldn't be good for Kirk, and I can't see him staying long with that. |
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Post by Walitzer on Jun 2, 2021 12:08:35 GMT
Yup and I can see their logic.. Kirk as things stand is a flash in the pan talent for GB standards.. until they are producing 10 of him per year teams in this case in the NLA will be reluctant to take him on especially from where he's from if teams in Switzerland are hesitant there's no chance teams from the SHL will entertain him. Like I've said before Kirks best bet is to carve out a career as a bottom 6 forward in the AHL as long as he's prepared to spend the next 10+ years away over the pond Why is Kirk's best bet, as a goal-scoring forward, to play on the more physical and defensively minded lines of an AHL team? |
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Post by bobness on Jun 2, 2021 12:57:42 GMT
Yup and I can see their logic.. Kirk as things stand is a flash in the pan talent for GB standards.. until they are producing 10 of him per year teams in this case in the NLA will be reluctant to take him on especially from where he's from if teams in Switzerland are hesitant there's no chance teams from the SHL will entertain him. Like I've said before Kirks best bet is to carve out a career as a bottom 6 forward in the AHL as long as he's prepared to spend the next 10+ years away over the pond Why is Kirk's best bet, as a goal-scoring forward, to play on the more physical and defensively minded lines of an AHL team? GM "I've signed this English guy. Heck of a skater, great release, scores goals for fun. We need some goals right now. Let's have a look at him." Coach "Sure, boss, I'll stick him on the fourth line with Psycho McCrosscheck and Pierre Cantpasswontpass..."  The Swiss article surely loses a little in translation, but like I said, if you're not a little bit keen, why say anything at all? You'd just say "Well, yes, he's had a good tournament, and I wish him well, but we're not looking there." Genuinely interested to see where Kirk goes from here, and how he progresses. He's certainly put himself in the shop window for far better leagues than the EIHL. You never know. |
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Post by Walitzer on Jun 2, 2021 13:54:10 GMT
Why is Kirk's best bet, as a goal-scoring forward, to play on the more physical and defensively minded lines of an AHL team? GM "I've signed this English guy. Heck of a skater, great release, scores goals for fun. We need some goals right now. Let's have a look at him." Coach "Sure, boss, I'll stick him on the fourth line with Psycho McCrosscheck and Pierre Cantpasswontpass..." The Swiss article surely loses a little in translation, but like I said, if you're not a little bit keen, why say anything at all? You'd just say "Well, yes, he's had a good tournament, and I wish him well, but we're not looking there." Genuinely interested to see where Kirk goes from here, and how he progresses. He's certainly put himself in the shop window for far better leagues than the EIHL. You never know. It'll give him a good opportunity to work on his right hook! Definitely a weaker aspect of his game.
I agree that the fact SC Bern is even talking about Kirk is very positive news, Mora IK seem very keen aswell so it looks like he's not going to land anywhere lower than a decent Alsvenskan team, which is a great start for what is essentially his first proper professional season.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2021 14:16:19 GMT
Yup and I can see their logic.. Kirk as things stand is a flash in the pan talent for GB standards.. until they are producing 10 of him per year teams in this case in the NLA will be reluctant to take him on especially from where he's from if teams in Switzerland are hesitant there's no chance teams from the SHL will entertain him. Like I've said before Kirks best bet is to carve out a career as a bottom 6 forward in the AHL as long as he's prepared to spend the next 10+ years away over the pond Why is Kirk's best bet, as a goal-scoring forward, to play on the more physical and defensively minded lines of an AHL team? Do you think the bottom 6 forwards are knuckle draggers ! I'll tell you now he won't be on one of their top lines .. my opinion I'm getting vibes people are expecting too much of him |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 2, 2021 14:19:21 GMT
Why is Kirk's best bet, as a goal-scoring forward, to play on the more physical and defensively minded lines of an AHL team? GM "I've signed this English guy. Heck of a skater, great release, scores goals for fun. We need some goals right now. Let's have a look at him." Coach "Sure, boss, I'll stick him on the fourth line with Psycho McCrosscheck and Pierre Cantpasswontpass..." The Swiss article surely loses a little in translation, but like I said, if you're not a little bit keen, why say anything at all? You'd just say "Well, yes, he's had a good tournament, and I wish him well, but we're not looking there." Genuinely interested to see where Kirk goes from here, and how he progresses. He's certainly put himself in the shop window for far better leagues than the EIHL. You never know. I'm interested as well.. too see how long he can stay abroad before wanting to return 'home' |
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Post by Walitzer on Jun 2, 2021 15:08:13 GMT
Why is Kirk's best bet, as a goal-scoring forward, to play on the more physical and defensively minded lines of an AHL team? Do you think the bottom 6 forwards are knuckle draggers ! I'll tell you now he won't be on one of their top lines .. my opinion I'm getting vibes people are expecting too much of him While I can't personally comment on the knuckle dragging status of all bottom 6 AHL forwards or even forum posters. The role of a third or fourth line player is undeniably more defensively focussed than the top two, theres an increased expectation of physicality with reduced goal scoring opportunities and ice time.
So why do you think that's the best option for Kirk's development, as a fast skating, puck-handling, goal-scoring player?
Just my opinion, but I would argue he'd be better off playing in the best league that will offer him a top 6 position.
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Post by bobness on Jun 2, 2021 15:26:36 GMT
Just my opinion, but I would argue he'd be better off playing in the best league that will offer him a top 6 position. I could get behind that. It's a bit like an opening batsman getting a job as an all-rounder if he goes to be a "bottom 6" forward, regardless of his level (NHL excepted). He's a fast skating, quick release, super aware, goal scorer, it would appear. Those kinds of players can be in demand. One hopes he can get with a team who can offer him chances in that area. After that, it's up to him and Lady Luck. |
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Post by ashfieldpanther on Jun 8, 2021 6:21:54 GMT
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Post by bobness on Jun 9, 2021 16:42:02 GMT
It's certainly the kind of level I'd like to see him at. Liiga, SHL, Swiss A (whatever it is now), Czech.
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Post by langer on Jun 9, 2021 19:33:03 GMT
Is he import quality standard enough to play in Liiga, SHL, NLA, Czech considering import limits ?
Coyotes still have June 22 to sign him, are they impressed enough to give him his entry level contract now for the 21/22 season after seeing him in Riga ? They just gave their 2020 7th round pick his ELC, another left winger.
If he gets the ELC he'll end up in Tucson (AHL), if no deal for 21/22 the first question is the key, import standards are high in those leagues. If not where down the chain after those leagues ?
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langer
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Post by langer on Jun 16, 2021 13:41:42 GMT
Arizona according to reports in Toronto media today don't seem interested in giving Kirk an entry level contract so they have given other NHL teams the OK to talk to his agent, if there's interest by other teams a trade for his NHL rights held by Arizona to June/22 would be needed.
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Post by Bagheera on Jun 18, 2021 6:59:11 GMT
 Still not confirmed but fantastic news if true. |
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Post by Yotes on Oct 22, 2021 13:58:20 GMT
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