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Post by Sheetmaself on Dec 28, 2017 10:01:34 GMT
The problem is that i support the club.
Whats the best way to do this?
By not going hitting them where it hurts and hoping for change, but at the same time potentially causing lasting damage.
Or
By going and supporting them and hoping that they can work there way through the changes required.
Honestly i dont know the answer, i would be very careful of going through with option 1 as the damage caused may be irrevocable but on the other hand for the past five years i have been going and hoping for change.
The big issue is that for the next few matches there is a healthy number of seats sold, the club has got that big that even if you or i dont go there will be people who will still be attending as they have chosen option 2 (to be clear i have no issue with people chosing either option).
I am not a season ticket holder and never will be as i like to go to matches with different groups of people and a season ticket would not allow this, but there has been a marked change in availability of seats. You cannot get row A anymore which was my preference and big games will sell out whereas 4 years ago only the Steelers Christmas game sold out.
This post is a wandering brain fart of a post as that is how i am feeling about this club right now.
They wont stop me supporting them.
They need to change.
I dont know how to affect this.
What do we think the value of the club is and do we think NB would sell to a serious buyer?
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Post by cooperphil156 on Dec 28, 2017 10:07:20 GMT
The problem is that i support the club. Whats the best way to do this? By not going hitting them where it hurts and hoping for change, but at the same time potentially causing lasting damage. Or By going and supporting them and hoping that they can work there way through the changes required. Honestly i dont know the answer, i would be very careful of going through with option 1 as the damage caused may be irrevocable but on the other hand for the past five years i have been going and hoping for change. The big issue is that for the next few matches there is a healthy number of seats sold, the club has got that big that even if you or i dont go there will be people who will still be attending as they have chosen option 2 (to be clear i have no issue with people chosing either option). I am not a season ticket holder and never will be as i like to go to matches with different groups of people and a season ticket would not allow this, but there has been a marked change in availability of seats. You cannot get row A anymore which was my preference and big games will sell out whereas 4 years ago only the Steelers Christmas game sold out. This post is a wandering brain fart of a post as that is how i am feeling about this club right now. They wont stop me supporting them. They need to change. I dont know how to affect this. What do we think the value of the club is and do we think NB would sell to a serious buyer? One things is for sure. If sales do go down NB will get worried as it starts to produce less profits. Non season ticket sales are the icing on the cake, on top of the banked season ticket sales. Apparently they were concerned last year at the slump. I also agree with others regarding too little too late to turn things around for a league challenge. I regarded the league as gone after the embarrassment of Boxing Day and this adds weight to this view.Cardiff are on a roll and Belfast have 22 out of 28 fixtures in the league left at home.
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Mark
Randall Weber
Experience has taught me that when it really matters the only person you can rely on is yourself.
Posts: 4,620
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Post by Mark on Dec 28, 2017 10:18:55 GMT
The problem is Neil Black sees the Panthers first and foremost as a business. I would guess he likes to win trophies but this is not essential to him as the club turns him a tidy profit as it stands. Why throw more money at the club when further investment guarantees nothing, especially when the arena is full or nearly full during such a poor spell of form?
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grrm
Pat Casey
Posts: 223
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Post by grrm on Dec 28, 2017 10:35:39 GMT
The problem is Neil Black sees the Panthers first and foremost as a business. I would guess he likes to win trophies but this is not essential to him as the club turns him a tidy profit as it stands. Why throw more money at the club when further investment guarantees nothing, especially when the arena is full or nearly full during such a poor spell of form? Hence why I've said - the only way to change the toxic management is by stopping going and stop buying over priced merchandise. It will take time but Black will become bored making less profit and more inclined to sell as a result. The "asking price" for the club will be lower, therefore making it more attractive to new potential buyers. I have now stopped attending, urge others to do the same, but will be back in a heartbeat as soon as Black / Moran are gone.
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Post by Hockey Fights UK on Dec 28, 2017 10:41:59 GMT
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Post by fishman on Dec 28, 2017 10:44:44 GMT
This problem is the coaching staff/players, CN is a one trick pony, and the players have lost the plot, Panthers need to get back to playing hockey and not like this.
They did it in the CHL with this same team, knuckle down get them in training every day, and with a couple of new players (hopefully) they can bring some respectability back to the team.
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Post by pantherlee on Dec 28, 2017 10:47:36 GMT
Gagnon may get a ban for being the aggressor but fitz must get some retrospective action for being 3rd man in watching that
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Post by texpef on Dec 28, 2017 10:52:41 GMT
Well, as one who has been critical of the forwards when we were winning its no surprise when others on the team arent covering their shortcomings we have started losing. Players like shalla arent bad players but if they cant perform in Nottingham they will need to be released and sign others who can and all this should have been done weeks ago not now, now it feels like a knee jerk reaction to arrest any lack of support from fans (and arrest the hit in the pocket).
If the coach cannot motivate and clearly he cant or if he cannot find a way to win then he really should be replaced too, this is a results business or at least it should be and he cannot live on past glories, its the here and now and the reality is that its not good enough and we appear to have a coach who cannot for whatever reason change this.
IF this is caused higher up then thats down to the owner who i suspect puts profits over success (given what i have witnessed since he has took over the club) and if he is getting in the profits then i guess nothing is going to change.
As a very long term fan i have put in years of watching other teams take league success over profits so a bang and bust club is not a way to be sustainable BUT putting profits over success is not the way to run a professional sports club either as in theory the whole ethos of a sports club is to get success in whatever sports they are taking part in. IF the club are more content to keep banking the ching rather than winning then i am sorry but i am going to put my money in the club when i think its worth supporting and hence i havent seen them play since they started on their losing streak and by all accounts i havent missed anything, i certainly dont feel i have missed out as i am a bear with a sore head when i leave after another loss and am disappointed/angry/annoyed/fed up/sad/cheated/robbed/not had value for my money/feel like kicking the cat (delete as appropriate). Steelers fans have proved over the years if they vote with their feet then the club will do all it can to have on ice success maybe that is what is needed to shake this malaise from the Nottingham club.
Yes the club should have had replacement imports not only for the injuries but for competition for places and maybe the import forwards may not be underperforming now. However saying that halfpenny is clearly more important even for a club making as much money as what panthers are likely to be making....
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Post by thebestpanthers on Dec 28, 2017 10:53:26 GMT
The problem is that i support the club. Whats the best way to do this? By not going hitting them where it hurts and hoping for change, but at the same time potentially causing lasting damage. Or By going and supporting them and hoping that they can work there way through the changes required. Honestly i dont know the answer, i would be very careful of going through with option 1 as the damage caused may be irrevocable but on the other hand for the past five years i have been going and hoping for change. The big issue is that for the next few matches there is a healthy number of seats sold, the club has got that big that even if you or i dont go there will be people who will still be attending as they have chosen option 2 (to be clear i have no issue with people chosing either option). I am not a season ticket holder and never will be as i like to go to matches with different groups of people and a season ticket would not allow this, but there has been a marked change in availability of seats. You cannot get row A anymore which was my preference and big games will sell out whereas 4 years ago only the Steelers Christmas game sold out. This post is a wandering brain fart of a post as that is how i am feeling about this club right now. They wont stop me supporting them. Agree with a lot that you say - my problem is despite the poor form I still enjoy watching hockey, and it gets me away from the T.V. - Any talk of a boycott or anything will not work, as the club has already banked the Season Ticket money, and there are usually enough passing traffic to keep the numbers up - a lot of long term fans will give up going but new ones will take their place They need to change. I dont know how to affect this. What do we think the value of the club is and do we think NB would sell to a serious buyer?
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Post by messier1851 on Dec 28, 2017 11:17:22 GMT
Having slept on it to consider my words, here goes. I live and work in Manchester so I will readily admit I don't watch the Panthers that often, so I won't take offence if people disagree or correct me on certain things. My last trip to the NIC was for the Zurich game and despite the result, there was a team that played their hearts out for 60 minutes and ultimately came up just short against a hugely talented side.
That was a world away from last night's complete shambles. I exclude Mike Garnett from this who frankly must wonder why he bothered last night and is probably looking into doing his MBA full time and getting the hell out of town!
Firstly, the lines, to me, do not make any sense whatsoever. I appreciate what David Clarke has done during his time in Nottingham, but for him to be playing first line hockey in the year of Our Lord 2017? No. We have lacked a first line centre for years, probably since David Ling's departure and yet again we have a collection of wingers and no real centres. Our only actual centre and playmaker, Zach Phillips, is playing right wing. Our blue chip goalscorer, 30+ goals in the coast last season is playing on a checking line. I'm not making excuses for Shalla's performances, last night he was one of the worst of the bunch, but why on earth is he playing on that line. It's little wonder he is getting frustrated at feeding off scraps and he isn't putting the puck in the net. Only Brett Perlini averages a point per game. That's damning.
Talk of two new faces is too late, does this mean Mosey is out longer than anticipated? Bussieres is clearly playing hurt, who knows if a couple of others are carrying injuries too. A spare import or two to rotate into the line-up would make a huge difference this time of year with so many games.
Tactics? Dump the puck to the back of the net and hope for the best, might have been acceptable against superior CHL sides who aren't used to an aggressive forecheck but in the Elite League, not good enough. Especially not good enough if you're forechecking is as poor as it was last night. We showed up for about the first two minutes of each period.
Brock Wilson's tweet is very interesting, would like to know how far up he is pointing the finger of blame.
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Post by Bagheera on Dec 28, 2017 11:25:32 GMT
Having slept on it to consider my words, here goes. I live and work in Manchester so I will readily admit I don't watch the Panthers that often, so I won't take offence if people disagree or correct me on certain things. My last trip to the NIC was for the Zurich game and despite the result, there was a team that played their hearts out for 60 minutes and ultimately came up just short against a hugely talented side. That was a world away from last night's complete shambles. I exclude Mike Garnett from this who frankly must wonder why he bothered last night and is probably looking into doing his MBA full time and getting the hell out of town! Firstly, the lines, to me, do not make any sense whatsoever. I appreciate what David Clarke has done during his time in Nottingham, but for him to be playing first line hockey in the year of Our Lord 2017? No. We have lacked a first line centre for years, probably since David Ling's departure and yet again we have a collection of wingers and no real centres. Our only actual centre and playmaker, Zach Phillips, is playing right wing. Our blue chip goalscorer, 30+ goals in the coast last season is playing on a checking line. I'm not making excuses for Shalla's performances, last night he was one of the worst of the bunch, but why on earth is he playing on that line. It's little wonder he is getting frustrated at feeding off scraps and he isn't putting the puck in the net. Only Brett Perlini averages a point per game. That's damning. Talk of two new faces is too late, does this mean Mosey is out longer than anticipated? Bussieres is clearly playing hurt, who knows if a couple of others are carrying injuries too. A spare import or two to rotate into the line-up would make a huge difference this time of year with so many games. Tactics? Dump the puck to the back of the net and hope for the best, might have been acceptable against superior CHL sides who aren't used to an aggressive forecheck but in the Elite League, not good enough. Especially not good enough if you're forechecking is as poor as it was last night. We showed up for about the first two minutes of each period. Brock Wilson's tweet is very interesting, would like to know how far up he is pointing the finger of blame. If I am to be fair to Corey(believe me its not easy, I was seconds away from leaning over the bench and telling him a few of my thoughts last night and I sit in block 13) Shalla was on that line because he has tried everything else to get him going. The 2 or 3 previous games before last night he even reverted back to Farmer, Perlini & Shalla. That didn't work so dumped him back down to try let the rest produce. I've battered him time and time again for lines, but you have to have some sympathy with this side of it at the minute. Where the bloody hell do you go with absoloutly nobody producing. I'm lost as to where he can go from here. Don't let any of this post take away from the fact he needs to go by the way. His job to get them playing.
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Post by pantherdman on Dec 28, 2017 12:54:48 GMT
Neilson wenger
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Post by block9 on Dec 28, 2017 13:13:40 GMT
Totally embarrassed to be a Panthers fan tonight. Sick and tired of being taken for a mug by this club,one which treats its fans with complete disdain. A club which cares only about making money,not about what happens on the ice. Year after year the same thing happens,but the same mistakes get made next year and again the next. The same excuses are made after every loss and yet the very people who should take the heat are allowed to hide. A club where "yes men" survive,but one which is absolutely scared to death of any guy who shows honesty,fight and passion. It's a club that by its own admission is in a "results business" but is one where bad results never actually bring any consequences. From the outside,everything looks glamorous,shiny and fine in Pantherland,yet inside its a club totally rotten to the core. A team coached by a guy with no personality,no passion,no fight,just one full of excuses and lame talk. This guy is backed up by a GM so arrogant and ignorant,he thinks he's bigger than the club,yet a guy almost universally hated by his own fans. Yet this guy is backed by an owner who seems to have little clue about what actually goes on in his club,cares only about money or Europe and always takes the lazy or safe option. Time to change Panthers,I've had enough,a season too far for me and I'm sure I'm not alone. There are far better things to spend money on than a club which doesn't care !
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Post by block9 on Dec 28, 2017 13:14:12 GMT
100% correct....
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Post by Flying Viking on Dec 28, 2017 13:32:06 GMT
From today's NEP
To be honest, last night I was looking for that to happen. But we know the consequences would be severe. As a professional sports team and coach, that would be the wrong move. But as a group of frustrated players and frustrated fans, I think we needed it to happen, and sod the consequences. This season is done for unless something drastic happens. That would have been about drastic enough.
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EMB
Randall Weber
Posts: 4,069
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Post by EMB on Dec 28, 2017 14:06:13 GMT
Its funny how things turn around, almost every season our forum and Steeltalk mirror each other, not 3 weeks ago Steeltalk was in complete meltdown and they wanted rid of Tom & Jerry & the estate agent not a peep on our forum, now its our turn and the Corey out banners have been dusted off from last season and everything is rosy in Steelerland, swings and roundabouts..lol
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Yotes
Forum Admin
Posts: 16,624
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Post by Yotes on Dec 28, 2017 15:04:16 GMT
I appreciate what David Clarke has done during his time in Nottingham, but for him to be playing first line hockey in the year of Our Lord 2017? No. Great post, especially that bit, it's baffling. Can't blame GM for Dave being permanently on the ice (first PP unit too, insofar as we have PP units), that sits firmly with Corey. Agree with Kazste too, not going is a difficult step.
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Post by pantherdman on Dec 28, 2017 15:06:40 GMT
From today's NEP To be honest, last night I was looking for that to happen. But we know the consequences would be severe. As a professional sports team and coach, that would be the wrong move. But as a group of frustrated players and frustrated fans, I think we needed it to happen, and sod the consequences. This season is done for unless something drastic happens. That would have been about drastic enough. Should have cleared the benches, could have changed the season. The rule is always clear the bench esp if you losing 4-0 lol
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kgw
Jade Galbraith
Posts: 181
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Post by kgw on Dec 28, 2017 16:15:06 GMT
Gagnon may get a ban for being the aggressor but fitz must get some retrospective action for being 3rd man in watching that I don't think it counts as "third man in" if the second man isn't actually involved in the fight, which seemed to the case there.
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Post by pantherdman on Dec 28, 2017 18:01:29 GMT
Gagnon may get a ban for being the aggressor but fitz must get some retrospective action for being 3rd man in watching that I don't think it counts as "third man in" if the second man isn't actually involved in the fight, which seemed to the case there. It’s text book third man in, the exact reason the rule was brought in. Also I believe fighting with a cage on is a kicking out offence. Can’t wait for the dops report “this type of behaviour is frowned upon, it harks back to old time and sent the crowd into a near frenzy, it must be out laww’d. 2 very naughty boys, off to bed without supper.” Personally I’d give them a reward.
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,484
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Post by iginla on Dec 28, 2017 19:48:19 GMT
Its funny how things turn around, almost every season our forum and Steeltalk mirror each other, not 3 weeks ago Steeltalk was in complete meltdown and they wanted rid of Tom & Jerry & the estate agent not a peep on our forum, now its our turn and the Corey out banners have been dusted off from last season and everything is rosy in Steelerland, swings and roundabouts..lol Hope you're not including me in that "3 weeks ago not a peep" EMB. I've been telling you for 3 years that Neilsons time was up and for at least a month that changes and spares were needed. Ooooooh......I wish there was a Q+A with Neil Black this week !
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Yotes
Forum Admin
Posts: 16,624
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Post by Yotes on Dec 28, 2017 20:01:17 GMT
No one would ever use the phrase "not a peep" in connection with you Iggy.
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,484
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Post by iginla on Dec 28, 2017 20:07:58 GMT
"Could be". It's the usual thing with Neilson, start well, get to this time of the year and begin to stink, when that gets too bad bring in a couple of ringers to salvage something. Exactly. Why can't these late "ringers" be signed in the initial roster ? We always wait,far too long before realising too late it's gone tits up,then start spending money we should have spent in the first place. Jesus,Panthers could sign a team nobody else in this league could live with if they wanted to,without even making more than a small dent in profits. They just don't want to win enough though. If this years team is Panthers most expensive ever,then sorry Mr Black,but you've had the wool pulled over your eyes by Neilson and Moran.
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EMB
Randall Weber
Posts: 4,069
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Post by EMB on Dec 28, 2017 20:09:28 GMT
Its funny how things turn around, almost every season our forum and Steeltalk mirror each other, not 3 weeks ago Steeltalk was in complete meltdown and they wanted rid of Tom & Jerry & the estate agent not a peep on our forum, now its our turn and the Corey out banners have been dusted off from last season and everything is rosy in Steelerland, swings and roundabouts..lol Hope you're not including me in that "3 weeks ago not a peep" EMB. I've been telling you for 3 years that Neilsons time was up and for at least a month that changes and spares were needed. Ooooooh......I wish there was a Q+A with Neil Black this week ! Haha I bet you wish there was a Q&A. Mind you you’d probably get banned from the arena the mood NB is in, anyone getting too close or rocking the boat is banned...lol. (No disrespect to a Rob by the way)
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,484
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Post by iginla on Dec 28, 2017 20:44:43 GMT
Hope you're not including me in that "3 weeks ago not a peep" EMB. I've been telling you for 3 years that Neilsons time was up and for at least a month that changes and spares were needed. Ooooooh......I wish there was a Q+A with Neil Black this week ! Haha I bet you wish there was a Q&A. Mind you you’d probably get banned from the arena the mood NB is in, anyone getting too close or rocking the boat is banned...lol. (No disrespect to a Rob by the way) I certainly do....but he daren't haha. Was Black there yesterday ? If not,why not and it's about bloody time he was !!!!
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