sunbeam
David Clarke
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Post by sunbeam on Apr 16, 2010 10:42:28 GMT
Congrats Notts on the promotion, a great achievement given all the off field distractions this season. With Panthers lifting the CC it would be great to see all 3 teams (Panthers, Notts and Forest) achieve something this season. Great for Nottingham sport. Forest have already achieved more than the Panthers did winning a tinpot trophy. Yes Notts have done all that they could do this season. But what comes next is what really matters.....
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Post by pantherinmanc on Apr 16, 2010 11:32:31 GMT
Indeed, I wasn't suggestig it was a competition, just pointing out that it would be nice to sit back and take some pride in Nottingham's sports teams. Tinpot trophy or not there are not many cities of comparable size that would be able to boast success on a par with Nottingham's sports teams if Forest got promotion, we should be proud of what we have in Nottingham.
I wasn't going to comment on the 'mask-gate' scandal discussed on the previous page, however i've just found out that the aforementioned mask is part of a job lot being sold by Notts themselves. Needing money desperately or not it is a disgrace that they see fit to make masks depicting a guy like Hughes as some sort of a hero. I'm sure the family of the person Lee Hughes hit and left for dead will be delighted to see the person who killed their family member being worshipped by a few hundred football fans.
Poor taste and a poor move by Notts. Make a mask of Cotterill, Graham Lee or whoever but not that guy. in some respects Lee Hughes should have to pay forever for what he did and Notts should consider that in their marketing moves. I have no qualms with Hughes playing football, he did his time and is entitled to earn a living but there are boundaries of respectability and morality to consider, if not to the wider public then to the victim of Hughes' crime and this shows him and his family no respect whatsoever.
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Rich
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Post by Rich on Apr 17, 2010 20:36:53 GMT
Indeed, I wasn't suggestig it was a competition, just pointing out that it would be nice to sit back and take some pride in Nottingham's sports teams. Tinpot trophy or not there are not many cities of comparable size that would be able to boast success on a par with Nottingham's sports teams if Forest got promotion, we should be proud of what we have in Nottingham. I wasn't going to comment on the 'mask-gate' scandal discussed on the previous page, however i've just found out that the aforementioned mask is part of a job lot being sold by Notts themselves. Needing money desperately or not it is a disgrace that they see fit to make masks depicting a guy like Hughes as some sort of a hero. I'm sure the family of the person Lee Hughes hit and left for dead will be delighted to see the person who killed their family member being worshipped by a few hundred football fans. Poor taste and a poor move by Notts. Make a mask of Cotterill, Graham Lee or whoever but not that guy. in some respects Lee Hughes should have to pay forever for what he did and Notts should consider that in their marketing moves. I have no qualms with Hughes playing football, he did his time and is entitled to earn a living but there are boundaries of respectability and morality to consider, if not to the wider public then to the victim of Hughes' crime and this shows him and his family no respect whatsoever. Have a word with yourself. Would you rather we all made signs saying "were all sorry" and have a minutes silence before every game, or not celebrate any goals? As you said, he did his time, as soon as he puts a football shirt on and puts in the effort he does, he should acheive sufficient recognition. You cant say you accept him playing, then not expect the fans to take to him in this way. There is only Kasper who could have been considered up with Hughes. Cotterill, our current temporary manager whos been here a few weeks and our solid Centre back who nobody outside the ground would recognise dont cut it. Still, lets not get started, as said, this isnt the place. If you feel that strongly, go and post on a forum where you can debate it. You know full well you wont get one here.
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Dan
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Post by Dan on Apr 18, 2010 17:18:08 GMT
I don't expect to get the debate, but why not here? We're all grown ups and as long as it doesn't descend into libellous or childish material then it's fine surely?
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Rich
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Post by Rich on Apr 18, 2010 17:35:51 GMT
I don't expect to get the debate, but why not here? We're all grown ups and as long as it doesn't descend into libellous or childish material then it's fine surely? So you wanna use a Notts catch up thread on a Panthers forum to discuss the actions of one man several years ago, knowing full well your only going to get 1, maybe 2 Notts fans opinion's, if that? Unless you really have nothing better to do, Id say thats a bit of a waste of time. Then, as you say there is the potential for the discussion hitting nerves, but I wasnt even thinking that tbh.
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Dan
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Post by Dan on Apr 18, 2010 17:54:34 GMT
This thread is 56 pages long Rich, surely there's more than 1 or 2 Notts fans on here fella? You only need 2 people for a discussion after all. Anyway, i don't have time
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Post by Alf Garnett on Apr 18, 2010 18:07:22 GMT
This thread is 56 pages long Rich, surely there's more than 1 or 2 Notts fans There are 3 of us who a regular on here and 2 of us are moderators. I think it is time the side issue of a Notts players previous form should be consigned to the past. Nobody is whiter than white and it would likewise be churlish for us to drag up a former club chairman who ended up serving time for financial irregularities. He's done the crime and he's done his time.
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Rich
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Post by Rich on Apr 19, 2010 8:28:31 GMT
Right then, back on topic.... Ray Trew has been very disappointed with the constant digs by officials at other League 2 clubs (Hopefully Maniche on Football League show reads this too) so has issued a public statement on the clubs website: Get your facts right. Love it! The "too good to be true" line will get thrown around no doubt but I dont think Ray Trew could possibly be anymore popular, short of keeping Sven when he first took over.
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sunbeam
David Clarke
The Panthers don't do league titles. Not even Carlsberg can manage that!
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Post by sunbeam on Apr 19, 2010 10:17:00 GMT
Right then, back on topic.... Ray Trew has been very disappointed with the constant digs by officials at other League 2 clubs (Hopefully Maniche on Football League show reads this too) so has issued a public statement on the clubs website: Get your facts right. Love it! The "too good to be true" line will get thrown around no doubt but I dont think Ray Trew could possibly be anymore popular, short of keeping Sven when he first took over. So Notts were over the cap this season. There's a shock. First the Notts fans ate up everything they were told by Munto. Then they believed everything from Trembling. And now they adore Trew. Some folk really are gullible. Unless Trew has invested millions in to the club this is a club with a massive debt. Trew is talking out of his backside. The FA Cup run would not have made much money as Notts never got a money tie. Of course Notts fans will disagree. It's deja vu all over again. So, as with Munto and Trembling, let's see what happens over the next few months.
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Rich
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Post by Rich on Apr 19, 2010 13:16:37 GMT
Right then, back on topic.... Ray Trew has been very disappointed with the constant digs by officials at other League 2 clubs (Hopefully Maniche on Football League show reads this too) so has issued a public statement on the clubs website: Get your facts right. Love it! The "too good to be true" line will get thrown around no doubt but I dont think Ray Trew could possibly be anymore popular, short of keeping Sven when he first took over. So Notts were over the cap this season. There's a shock. First the Notts fans ate up everything they were told by Munto. Then they believed everything from Trembling. And now they adore Trew. Some folk really are gullible. Unless Trew has invested millions in to the club this is a club with a massive debt. Trew is talking out of his backside. The FA Cup run would not have made much money as Notts never got a money tie. Of course Notts fans will disagree. It's deja vu all over again. So, as with Munto and Trembling, let's see what happens over the next few months. Perhaps, again though I dont see what the alternative is. RT is a local businessman with vast personal wealth who promised to get the club on a stable footing, but warned he would not be popular to begin with. Instead, weve got a chairman we can relate to, who has gone beyond all expectations. Not comparable in that sense to the Munto "project" at all. Id love to know the "master plan" but in the meantime, Iv been delighted with the way hes handled things. Trew HAS invested millions by the way, hes paid debts off running into the millions and has unconditionally given money to the club (the only way to get round the cap). As I said, Id love to know the details of that investment, and how hes going to get it back but we wont!
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sunbeam
David Clarke
The Panthers don't do league titles. Not even Carlsberg can manage that!
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Post by sunbeam on Apr 19, 2010 14:32:19 GMT
So Notts were over the cap this season. There's a shock. First the Notts fans ate up everything they were told by Munto. Then they believed everything from Trembling. And now they adore Trew. Some folk really are gullible. Unless Trew has invested millions in to the club this is a club with a massive debt. Trew is talking out of his backside. The FA Cup run would not have made much money as Notts never got a money tie. Of course Notts fans will disagree. It's deja vu all over again. So, as with Munto and Trembling, let's see what happens over the next few months. Perhaps, again though I dont see what the alternative is. RT is a local businessman with vast personal wealth who promised to get the club on a stable footing, but warned he would not be popular to begin with. Instead, weve got a chairman we can relate to, who has gone beyond all expectations. Not comparable in that sense to the Munto "project" at all. Id love to know the "master plan" but in the meantime, Iv been delighted with the way hes handled things. Trew HAS invested millions by the way, hes paid debts off running into the millions and has unconditionally given money to the club (the only way to get round the cap). As I said, Id love to know the details of that investment, and how hes going to get it back but we wont! If he has done that then that would be very good. However, I was under the impression that he has never done such a thing at his previous club [Lincoln??] because he is 'only' worth a few million. People who blow a few million on a club tend to be worth a lot more than 5 or 10 million pounds.....??
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Rich
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Post by Rich on Apr 20, 2010 11:11:12 GMT
Perhaps, again though I dont see what the alternative is. RT is a local businessman with vast personal wealth who promised to get the club on a stable footing, but warned he would not be popular to begin with. Instead, weve got a chairman we can relate to, who has gone beyond all expectations. Not comparable in that sense to the Munto "project" at all. Id love to know the "master plan" but in the meantime, Iv been delighted with the way hes handled things. Trew HAS invested millions by the way, hes paid debts off running into the millions and has unconditionally given money to the club (the only way to get round the cap). As I said, Id love to know the details of that investment, and how hes going to get it back but we wont! If he has done that then that would be very good. However, I was under the impression that he has never done such a thing at his previous club [Lincoln??] because he is 'only' worth a few million. People who blow a few million on a club tend to be worth a lot more than 5 or 10 million pounds.....?? As with all people in business its difficult to gauge how much they are "worth" to be honest, but someone on a Notts forum did some digging and found either him, or a small group led by him purchased a loss making company (a recruitment firm iirc) for just under £20m, which now makes big money. I doubt a bloke worth 5M would be able to get the clout to do that in the first place, unless the people around him were worth a lot (as with the current situation). The reason Im being sketchy though is I cannot find the link. Your right though, he did nothing really at Lincoln, and Rodwell was 1/2 of the partnership that put Boston into the mess they are still trying to get out of so it hardly filled fans with joy when he took over, as I said though thats where it differs from the Munto situation, because hes promised nothing, and delivered a lot so far.
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Dan
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Post by Dan on Apr 20, 2010 15:43:22 GMT
Whether or not you're in the cap right now seems immaterial. It was revealed that Munto actually didn't put much money into the club at all after they left, and considering that Trew has had to invest now to keep you inside the cap, this must mean you've been breaking the cap all season to this point.
Basic logic, but i may be wrong.
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sunbeam
David Clarke
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Post by sunbeam on Apr 21, 2010 11:39:45 GMT
If he has done that then that would be very good. However, I was under the impression that he has never done such a thing at his previous club [Lincoln??] because he is 'only' worth a few million. People who blow a few million on a club tend to be worth a lot more than 5 or 10 million pounds.....?? As with all people in business its difficult to gauge how much they are "worth" to be honest, but someone on a Notts forum did some digging and found either him, or a small group led by him purchased a loss making company (a recruitment firm iirc) for just under £20m, which now makes big money. I doubt a bloke worth 5M would be able to get the clout to do that in the first place, unless the people around him were worth a lot (as with the current situation). The reason Im being sketchy though is I cannot find the link. Your right though, he did nothing really at Lincoln, and Rodwell was 1/2 of the partnership that put Boston into the mess they are still trying to get out of so it hardly filled fans with joy when he took over, as I said though thats where it differs from the Munto situation, because hes promised nothing, and delivered a lot so far. Depends on the banks I guess. £20m isn't that much. What we don't know is how deep Notts are in debt and if they are still bleeding money. Earlier the signs were that Notts were around £4m in debt and on course to be up to £8m in debt by the end of the season. Let's be kind and call it £5m. What we don't know is what the numbers are now and how much money the new ownership has injected in to the club. This money would have to be a gift rather than loans. Here's a possible plan - Inject £3m cash in and reduce the debt to say £3m. Sell players for £3m and get the cash back. Increased revenue and loss of high earners means Notts are no longer losing money and so remain around £3m in debt. With luck a cup run might cut the debt or Notts might unearth a player to sell for £££s. Worse case - team plummets - go in to Admin and wipe the £3m debt. The club is back in L2 but debt free and Trew has bought a club for buttons.
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Rich
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Post by Rich on Apr 21, 2010 15:53:29 GMT
Whether or not you're in the cap right now seems immaterial. It was revealed that Munto actually didn't put much money into the club at all after they left, and considering that Trew has had to invest now to keep you inside the cap, this must mean you've been breaking the cap all season to this point. Basic logic, but i may be wrong. I guess it depends when it is "checked" doesnt it. If it is continuously checked, then we were over, however if each club provides their financial details to the FL at the end of the season, for the season passed, we will get away with it. Im guessing by RT's attitude, it is the latter, hence hes now sorted the situation. I honestly dont know though, nor do many people it seems! Sunbeam, all very good workings, however.... Administration would not wipe out that amount. The debt we have would not be that easily wiped out. Plus, RT would lose a LOT of face, and the support of the fans because he claimed "it is too damaging to suppliers and local businesses", which wont have changed in the summer. It isnt black and white, there is a lot of complicated debt, much of which is now owed to Ray Trew and the board, going into Admin would lose them a lot of money, probably more so than any other single creditor. He claims, the plan is to get to the championship (very realistic if we keep the squad together and add3or4 good players, as long as we get a top class keeper or Kasper back on loan). If we can stop the flow, manage the debt, keep crowds up and go straight through L1 (lots of ifs I know!) then the debt suddenly looks tiny. He would have a club that barely loses money, worth a lot more than the debt it has. Thats his plan he says, and to be honest as ambitious as it is, it makes the most sense IMO (I await a slagging off from Pantherinmanc!) On the pitch, Notts have all but won the League 2 title after beating a fading Rochdale side last night 1.0. Over 10,500 fans, of which 1000 were Rochdale went aswell which is fantastic. 9500 Notts fans for a Tuesday night, regardless of the situation is very impressive IMO. It shows they are out there if nothing else!
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sunbeam
David Clarke
The Panthers don't do league titles. Not even Carlsberg can manage that!
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Post by sunbeam on Apr 21, 2010 16:48:28 GMT
Interesting post, Rich. The finances are murky but then we've been here before! The owner has pretty big plans but then we've been here before!! The crowd was good but you know people will come out. a club gets to Wembley and suddenly 20,000 fans turn up! Notts are a L1 club IMHO so I think you can stay in it. Depends on your finances. It's going to be an interesting few months. We've been here before!!!!!!!
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sunbeam
David Clarke
The Panthers don't do league titles. Not even Carlsberg can manage that!
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Post by sunbeam on Apr 22, 2010 14:00:01 GMT
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Rich
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Post by Rich on Apr 22, 2010 14:43:49 GMT
I fail to see why this has been posted on the Notts thread
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Post by KimThePanther on Apr 27, 2010 20:36:28 GMT
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Shorty
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Post by Shorty on Apr 28, 2010 10:20:37 GMT
Well done Notts. Hopefully back on the straight and narrow now.
Always good to see Nottinghamshire clubs doing well.
Who's your next keeper going to be now that Schmeichel has agreed to be released?
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Post by Lord of the Rinks on Apr 28, 2010 10:32:05 GMT
Well done you Pies. Big T, I don't want you coming to me in 30 years times and still going on about the Magpies winning the League 2 championship. Really, league 2 is the old 4th division. ;D
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Post by dodit on Apr 28, 2010 15:07:27 GMT
Good to see County have gone up. Usually ongoings behind the scenes at clubs usually upsets the performances off the pitch but this hasn't been the case. What I can't understand is that Schmeichel has been released. I mean I've heard that he's been released 'incase' the club don't manage to sell him, but it was highly likely that he was going to be bought seeing with all the interest in him, especially from Premier League clubs, and by the sounds of it, was willing to pay the price that County had put on them; surely wouldn't it have been more beneficial in terms of the money side if you put Schmeichel up for sale, give it till the end of July - after the transfer window had been open a month - and if you hadn't managed to shift him by then, then release him providing you had other targets to cover the start of the season. However I have heard a rumour already that County are targeting Paul Smith from forest next year as a season long loan.
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Rich
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Post by Rich on Apr 28, 2010 15:32:58 GMT
Dont worry Spike your not the only one wondering that! I believe the embargo prevents us selling him, so maybe the embargo will last longer than first thought.
Also heard Kasper was due a massive payout for us being champions and keeping so many clean sheets, which he has waived so saved us money in that way. If that figure was around £1m (which lets face it, under Munto wouldnt surprise anyone) then this makes sense also.
All we can do though is guess, and try and put 2+2 together. He was certainly worth between £500k - £1m even at a quick sale.
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sunbeam
David Clarke
The Panthers don't do league titles. Not even Carlsberg can manage that!
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Post by sunbeam on Apr 28, 2010 16:15:23 GMT
Kasper might now not have to take a pay cut and has opened up the chance to join plenty of clubs. If there had been a fee many clubs would have lost interest or may have wanted Kasper to take a sizable pay cut.
This is a sensible football decision by Kasper. Notts had no choice but to agree. If they had refused then Kasper could have refused to leave and forced Notts to pay him.
What this leaves us asking is how big the debts are and how are they going to be paid? Time will tell, I guess.
Anywho - congrats!
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Post by KimThePanther on Apr 28, 2010 17:37:23 GMT
I think (don't quote me on this) the embargo won't be lifted until the tax debt has been paid off completely, which I'm told will be done by the end May.
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