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Post by marchand63 on Nov 4, 2019 18:34:54 GMT
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Jord v4
Ken Westman
Harbinger of Doom
Posts: 2,714
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Post by Jord v4 on Nov 4, 2019 18:39:02 GMT
Wonder who their SM guy will be....
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Post by Bagheera on Nov 4, 2019 18:49:08 GMT
Hugely dissapointing this article. No suggestion of Panthers joining. ☹
London and Nottingham. That'd sounds good for 2 teams.
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Shaggy
Forum Moderator 
Am I a cynical idealist or an idealistic cynic?
Posts: 10,995
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Post by Shaggy on Nov 4, 2019 18:50:03 GMT
Deja vu all over again?
Not only is it in the Daily Fail, but every time we hear about "negotiations" like this, it usually turns out that someone's just said "yeah, well... we'd like to, maybe... someday...".
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Post by spik on Nov 4, 2019 20:55:30 GMT
Not in my life might be a short quote from myself. However, if this takes off and if Nottingham's owner leaves for this venture, might we be able as a club to concentrate on domestic league interest?
No new owner and fewer funds for Panthers in the future if Mr.Black remains?
No Nottingham team and the death of Lace City hockey?
Nottingham playing out of London/Reading - Nah.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2019 21:00:40 GMT
The cost of running a team to compete in the KHL would be astronomical! Only a team playing out of the capital would financially be able to afford it.. for starters the player budget would need to be 7 figures minimum
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meadow
Jade Galbraith
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Post by meadow on Nov 4, 2019 21:11:46 GMT
Not to doubt Blacky's / the Bermuda Boys coffers, but this would be a massive financial undertaking to begin with - the KHL reports that teams average salary bill is approx £8m per season, not to mention the massive travel costs.
If you look at Kunlun Red Star the most recent example of KHL expansion, their attendance is fairly rubbish (I've seen games where there looks to be 1000 people there tops) but I believe they are propped up by TV money, advertising and a massive sponsorship deal, so its technically possible to run a team where the attendances are less than 10k.
In London you'd probably have bigger crowds than Kunlun (capital city - plenty of US / Can ex-pats and Russian oligarchs and ahem... 'homeowners') and would also be able to attract players from NA who'd rather live in an English speaking country. Given the reach the league would have, it should be possible to get a nice sponsorship deal too.
Because we don't have a massive amount top end Brits, I'd imagine the KHL would have to give a London team a similar import deal to Kunlun where they mix X amount of Chinese OR Russian players with the imports from NA and elsewhere. But you'd also have a lot more Canadian Brits - such as one Mr Danny Taylor - to pick from than Kunlun had Canadian Chinese players.
Hopefully it'd be positive for the EIHL too; raise the profile of the UK game generally, and teams could attract imports who were angling for a potential KHL job.
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Post by Bagheera on Nov 4, 2019 21:15:41 GMT
The cost of running a team to compete in the KHL would be astronomical! Only a team playing out of the capital would financially be able to afford it.. for starters the player budget would need to be 7 figures minimum What makes you think that pidge. Thats a genuine question, not being arguementative. Is it just the ability to attract better sponsors? I'm no expert but I have some thoughts. Firstly, having looked at current arenas Nottingham would hold more than 9 other venues. Then, if you take into account you'd expect more teams this side of europe with the new expantion I think travel wouldn't be any more than some KHL teams already have to go. We'd probably have 3 or 4 teams closer than some KHL teams have 1. Also travel from Nottingham to everywhere else wouldn't really cost anymore than from London/Reading. Next you have an existing hockey market in Nottingham, if we hit the KHL yiu'd probably deag other fans in from futher afield to come and watch. Fianlly, I wouldn't expect the sponsorship money to come from UK shores anyway(maybe this is my biggest failing in my views). Id imagine most miney would come in from Russian TV and Russian sponsors. Id be more than happy with Gasprom and Russian writing everywhere if we got that standard of hockey. Oh, and another point I forgot. Cost of living/housing palyers etc is significantly cheaper out of London. For me, if it's viable in Reading it's viable in Nottingham. But as I say, maybe im massively under estimating the value London has to investors and sponship |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2019 21:26:19 GMT
The cost of running a team to compete in the KHL would be astronomical! Only a team playing out of the capital would financially be able to afford it.. for starters the player budget would need to be 7 figures minimum What makes you think that pidge. Thats a genuine question, not being arguementative. Is it just the ability to attract better sponsors? I'm no expert but I have some thoughts. Firstly, having looked at current arenas Nottingham would hold more than 9 other venues. Then, if you take into account you'd expect more teams this side of europe with the new expantion I think travel wouldn't be any more than some KHL teams already have to go. We'd probably have 3 or 4 teams closer than some KHL teams have 1. Also travel from Nottingham to everywhere else wouldn't really cost anymore than from London/Reading. Next you have an existing hockey market in Nottingham, if we hit the KHL yiu'd probably deag other fans in from futher afield to come and watch. Fianlly, I wouldn't expect the sponsorship money to come from UK shores anyway(maybe this is my biggest failing in my views). Id imagine most miney would come in from Russian TV and Russian sponsors. Id be more than happy with Gasprom and Russian writing everywhere if we got that standard of hockey. Oh, and another point I forgot. Cost of living/housing palyers etc is significantly cheaper out of London. For me, if it's viable in Reading it's viable in Nottingham. But as I say, maybe im massively under estimating the value London has to investors and sponship Attracting top sponsors (I.e. well know brands) would need to be a must just to fund the budget. Can you see Black still contribute a hefty sum towards that when he doesn't seem to fund a decent budget for this league? Sorry but this is a non starter for me. Its london or nowhere in the u.k. |
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meadow
Jade Galbraith
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Post by meadow on Nov 5, 2019 0:14:42 GMT
Have to agree, would be London (or London area-ish) or nothing for the KHL to succeed here. Its the only place you could get sponsors of sufficient size interested and the massive catchment of casual fans with money to spend.
Jokerit has already shown to some extent that if you pull a team out an existing league and dump it in the KHL then you lose a portion of the existing fans who want to see the rivalries. In London as a new enterprise this is a non-issue, you just get new / neutral fans looking for sports entertainment or corporate nights out.
For NB it'd be a no-brainer too - have your finger in the pie with the big time down in London and leave the provincial cash cow up here as is, churning out a nice little turnover year on year from the EIHL 'rivalries'!
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Post by kievthegreat on Nov 5, 2019 0:42:32 GMT
The cost of running a team to compete in the KHL would be astronomical! Only a team playing out of the capital would financially be able to afford it.. for starters the player budget would need to be 7 figures minimum What makes you think that pidge. Thats a genuine question, not being arguementative. Is it just the ability to attract better sponsors? I'm no expert but I have some thoughts. Firstly, having looked at current arenas Nottingham would hold more than 9 other venues. Then, if you take into account you'd expect more teams this side of europe with the new expantion I think travel wouldn't be any more than some KHL teams already have to go. We'd probably have 3 or 4 teams closer than some KHL teams have 1. Also travel from Nottingham to everywhere else wouldn't really cost anymore than from London/Reading. Next you have an existing hockey market in Nottingham, if we hit the KHL yiu'd probably deag other fans in from futher afield to come and watch. Fianlly, I wouldn't expect the sponsorship money to come from UK shores anyway(maybe this is my biggest failing in my views). Id imagine most miney would come in from Russian TV and Russian sponsors. Id be more than happy with Gasprom and Russian writing everywhere if we got that standard of hockey. Oh, and another point I forgot. Cost of living/housing palyers etc is significantly cheaper out of London. For me, if it's viable in Reading it's viable in Nottingham. But as I say, maybe im massively under estimating the value London has to investors and sponship If we take the average wage to be £8m as mentioned earlier, that is equivalent selling 266,667 tickets at £30. There are currently 30 home games in the regular season. That means to cover just the wage budget, you'd need to sell 8,888 every night (where are the extra 1,000 seats). Hopefully you'd get some sponsorship money to supplement tickets, but there's another massive cost to consider, travel. That currently includes at least one trip a year to each of the following: Beijing (5017 miles) Vladivostok (5236 miles) Khabarovsk (4974 miles) Novosibirsk (3205 miles) Omsk (2886 miles) Nur-sultan (2951 miles) The distance back and forth between those 6 stops is equivalent to circumnavigating the world twice. They might be the furthest teams, but that's only 20% of your away games. That's gonna cos a pretty penny for all those flights! Any team, even London will struggle without some significant sponsorship or a benevolent Oligarch. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2019 5:54:52 GMT
Have to agree, would be London (or London area-ish) or nothing for the KHL to succeed here. Its the only place you could get sponsors of sufficient size interested and the massive catchment of casual fans with money to spend. Jokerit has already shown to some extent that if you pull a team out an existing league and dump it in the KHL then you lose a portion of the existing fans who want to see the rivalries. In London as a new enterprise this is a non-issue, you just get new / neutral fans looking for sports entertainment or corporate nights out. For NB it'd be a no-brainer too - have your finger in the pie with the big time down in London and leave the provincial cash cow up here as is, churning out a nice little turnover year on year from the EIHL 'rivalries'! I doubt black could fund this as well as 2 eihl teams. Those khl sides are bankrolled by seriously rich people. If you want to see this standard I suggest travelling to Moscow and watching it or a cheaper option just watch it on freesports lol. |
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loupowell52
Robert Lachowicz
Grape Aficionado
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Post by loupowell52 on Nov 5, 2019 7:49:35 GMT
Complete Fantasy. Will not happen now or ever. Paul Newman's article is simply a space filling exercise.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2019 8:24:59 GMT
Complete Fantasy. Will not happen now or ever. Paul Newman's article is simply a space filling exercise. Regarding the Panthers/Nottingham I'd agree but its viable for london to be a franchise.. as especially if Paris is being looked at. Btw I hope it does get pulled off as I'd make a few trips down to London to watch some KHL probably more than to watch eihl hockey! Hey the NFL makes regular visits to the capital... why not hockey |
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Post by DonClaneone on Nov 6, 2019 13:37:26 GMT
There's bigger money in the NFL and American Football is more popular over here than Ice Hockey
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2019 14:56:16 GMT
There's bigger money in the NFL and American Football is more popular over here than Ice Hockey The nhl premier in 2007 at the 02 (2 games) sold out in days.. yup there was defo lack of interest there. Egg chasing is probably easier to follow for the average person than hockey hense why it's more popular |
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Post by nightwish on Nov 6, 2019 19:29:25 GMT
Reading seems strange, but for those who say it’s not viable - then with three greatest of respect I think you are underestimating what oligarch money can achieve ( forget Black in the equation he’s a nobody compared to Russian money)
It’s inteteresting to note that the LA Chargers franchise in the NFL maybe transferred to London - who would have thought a few years ago an NFL franchise may move to the UK?
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Post by ashfieldpanther on Nov 6, 2019 20:09:12 GMT
Reading seems strange, but for those who say it’s not viable - then with three greatest of respect I think you are underestimating what oligarch money can achieve ( forget Black in the equation he’s a nobody compared to Russian money) It’s inteteresting to note that the LA Chargers franchise in the NFL maybe transferred to London - who would have thought a few years ago an NFL franchise may move to the UK? According to Chargers owner, this is totally untrue. But you never know. Although there are cities in the US looking for a NFL franchise, and any team moving to UK would want guaranteed revenues. The novelty value still exists for the London games, plus the Chargers wouldnt rank high in terms of UK popularity, which tends to favour the Eastern coast teams. |
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Discoray
Robert Lachowicz
Simply Clantastic!
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Post by Discoray on Nov 7, 2019 22:26:51 GMT
This annual KHL notion has become UK Hockey’s equivalent of the “winter to end all winters” garbage that newspapers put out at the end of each autumn. Until something concrete actually happens, not worth anyone’s time reading about it.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 8, 2019 17:45:41 GMT
Reading seems strange, but for those who say it’s not viable - then with three greatest of respect I think you are underestimating what oligarch money can achieve ( forget Black in the equation he’s a nobody compared to Russian money) It’s inteteresting to note that the LA Chargers franchise in the NFL maybe transferred to London - who would have thought a few years ago an NFL franchise may move to the UK? According to Chargers owner, this is totally untrue. But you never know. Although there are cities in the US looking for a NFL franchise, and any team moving to UK would want guaranteed revenues. The novelty value still exists for the London games, plus the Chargers wouldnt rank high in terms of UK popularity, which tends to favour the Eastern coast teams. I disagree about the novelty factor being a thing. There are a number of games each year now in the UK, there's no big fanfare any more. Teams are just starting to see it as just another game now yet they sell out with ease still. Still a number of years away from them making the jump to give the UK a franchise as there are some great cities over here that are next in line for a team but it's definitely a case of when rather than if for a UK based NFL team. I was speaking to somebody in the Toronto Wolfpack(Rugby League)organisation a couple of weeks ago and they have had the NFL contact them about how they are making cross-transatlantic sport work. A lot of eyes are on them in the Super League. If they can be competitive next season, which I'm sure they will be signing players like Sonny Bill, then the path will have been well and truly laid for a big North American sports team to base itself in the UK. On the actual topic, can't see KHL being successful in the UK. Would have to be based in London and we know the issues teams have building and keeping a fan base in London, unless they specifically target one area but even then they won't be able to keep the crowds big enough. Londoners don't see themselves as Londoners. It's going to take a multi-millionare owner, investment in the UK game and a hell of a lot of patience for it to work. Just won't happen, on all 3 fronts. |
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