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Post by bobness on Jan 6, 2020 20:17:54 GMT
Bobness had a point. The majority of players Cardiff hang onto are all excellent players at east coast level.. Joey Martin being a prime example. They just excelled in this league Or "on the career wind down, but still a long way from totally rubbish yet". Hedden, McMonagle, McNamee, Linglet, Dixon, Ulmer, Bentivoglio, Morrisonn, Schiestel, Strachan etc etc. Cardiff's recruitment is rarely poor.
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iginla
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Post by iginla on Jan 6, 2020 20:27:56 GMT
I really hope Panthers can sign Herr to a longer term contract, but surely someone will be looking at the numbers and thinking that he could easily play in a far higher paying league next season? Here's hoping he likes mushy peas and mint sauce... a lot. What's interesting is the striking similarity between Herr's and Horvat's CVs, but the at present striking difference between their contributions in a Panthers shirt. Horvat isn't being used to his best yet, I fear. There's surely more to come from him? Again, nice problem to have. How many other players have Cardiff held onto who could play at higher levels? I can think of several. Fournier could surely play at a higher level than in Cardiff. As for Herr,i bet Simmsey has already tipped off Thommo to get the DEL looking at Herr,they’ll being doing all they can to try make sure he’s not at Panthers next year.
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Post by PantherB on Jan 6, 2020 21:08:50 GMT
How many other players have Cardiff held onto who could play at higher levels? I can think of several. Fournier could surely play at a higher level than in Cardiff. As for Herr,i bet Simmsey has already tipped off Thommo to get the DEL looking at Herr,they’ll being doing all they can to try make sure he’s not at Panthers next year. Thompson got fired a few weeks ago.
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iginla
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Post by iginla on Jan 6, 2020 21:28:59 GMT
Fournier could surely play at a higher level than in Cardiff. As for Herr,i bet Simmsey has already tipped off Thommo to get the DEL looking at Herr,they’ll being doing all they can to try make sure he’s not at Panthers next year. Thompson got fired a few weeks ago. Yes i know he did. That won’t stop Simmsey and his secret agents conspiring though.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2020 22:12:13 GMT
Thompson got fired a few weeks ago. Yes i know he did. That won’t stop Simmsey and his secret agents conspiring though. Simmsy doesn't have a great deal of power in the big wide world.. it's you being paranoid Iggy! If Herr leaves its because either his agent advised him or he chooses to head back to NA for another shot in the AHL.
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iginla
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Post by iginla on Jan 6, 2020 22:28:44 GMT
Yes i know he did. That won’t stop Simmsey and his secret agents conspiring though. Simmsy doesn't have a great deal of power in the big wide world.. it's you being paranoid Iggy! If Herr leaves its because either his agent advised him or he chooses to head back to NA for another shot in the AHL. I know Simmsey isn’t big fish,just thinks he is,but if he could help get Herr away from Panthers I bet he would. Judging by the interview with Herr when he was asked if he could be back next year I thought he was rather non commital. I reckon he’ll end up in one of the big Euro leagues next year.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2020 23:53:20 GMT
Simmsy doesn't have a great deal of power in the big wide world.. it's you being paranoid Iggy! If Herr leaves its because either his agent advised him or he chooses to head back to NA for another shot in the AHL. I know Simmsey isn’t big fish,just thinks he is,but if he could help get Herr away from Panthers I bet he would. Judging by the interview with Herr when he was asked if he could be back next year I thought he was rather non commital. I reckon he’ll end up in one of the big Euro leagues next year. Let's be honest. He is too good for this league and there hasnt been many players over here from any team you could generally say that about I bet us having a player of Herrs ability is killing simmsy right now! The likes of Connelly vallerand deluca dont even come close
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Post by bobness on Jan 7, 2020 9:13:55 GMT
I know Simmsey isn’t big fish,just thinks he is,but if he could help get Herr away from Panthers I bet he would. Judging by the interview with Herr when he was asked if he could be back next year I thought he was rather non commital. I reckon he’ll end up in one of the big Euro leagues next year. Let's be honest. He is too good for this league and there hasnt been many players over here from any team you could generally say that about I bet us having a player of Herrs ability is killing simmsy right now! The likes of Connelly vallerand deluca dont even come close And yet Connolly has been scoring leader all year bar the last weekend, and has just had a 21 game points streak broken, Vallerand has the best points per game in the league by a mile (only has 3 pointless games so far this season), and DeLuca had a 7 point game the other night. Steelers are scoring goals for fun this season. Oh, and Steelers are sitting pretty way in front in the league table, points in the bag. I would think he's happy enough. But yes, if Panthers can keep Herr it would be outstanding news.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2020 9:29:20 GMT
Let's be honest. He is too good for this league and there hasnt been many players over here from any team you could generally say that about I bet us having a player of Herrs ability is killing simmsy right now! The likes of Connelly vallerand deluca dont even come close And yet Connolly has been scoring leader all year bar the last weekend, and has just had a 21 game points streak broken, Vallerand has the best points per game in the league by a mile (only has 3 pointless games so far this season), and DeLuca had a 7 point game the other night. Steelers are scoring goals for fun this season. Oh, and Steelers are sitting pretty way in front in the league table, points in the bag. I would think he's happy enough. But yes, if Panthers can keep Herr it would be outstanding news. Once games played gets levelled out Steelers wont be sitting as pretty as some think. I'd be happy if most of our d return. Lete be honest this Steelers team is like a Early Neilson panthers team.. run and gun..
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Post by texpef on Jan 7, 2020 12:48:59 GMT
I know Simmsey isn’t big fish,just thinks he is,but if he could help get Herr away from Panthers I bet he would. Judging by the interview with Herr when he was asked if he could be back next year I thought he was rather non commital. I reckon he’ll end up in one of the big Euro leagues next year. Let's be honest. He is too good for this league and there hasnt been many players over here from any team you could generally say that about I bet us having a player of Herrs ability is killing simmsy right now! The likes of Connelly vallerand deluca dont even come close "lets be honest" pidge he is far from the best player both in actual figures and pedigree to grace these shores or even grace the panthers. This season he has been very good for panthers but perhaps he is perceived to be better than he actually is due to the lack of quality in the rest of the bunch, afterall how long do you think Rheault would have been a steelers player given the lack of pretty much anything over the last two seasons. This is a team game and although Herr's individual stats are brilliant this means nothing if ultimately he leaves at the end of the season and nothing is won. Yes right now this far into the season it would seem imperative that his signature is secured for next season and a better team can be built around him but if as this season the ship is sunk for an halpeth o tar then its all academic isn't it. At the start of the season it was clear that the cash was splashed a lot in Sheffield who were very closely followed by Cardiff and Belfast with the quality within those squads and I too don't buy the but xxxxxx really wanted to play for us so bad he is on a bag of nuts and free sticks. Most people were predicting a 4th place team with those 3 leading the way and to be honest I really don't see any difference even now even with Herr on fire. To be challenging and unbelievably its still not too late (not very often we have said that about panthers in January) the team really do need to lose at least a player if not more of dead wood and get in quality and then come the run in who knows may even win it but the will to do whats necessary has to be seen within the club and if the team get a result this weekend I doubt very much that will is there... afterall a continental cup can be seen as a successful season without spending another penny...
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Gilly
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Post by Gilly on Jan 7, 2020 16:03:11 GMT
Rheault will be the spare import when Deutsch is fit and rightly so, 7 league goals in a season and a half for a player who was bought in as a "sniper" is quite frankly abysmal. Would have been gone a while back if he wasn't on a Uni deal
Besides that, i'm relatively pleased with how we currently line up. Yes a few players could provide some more offensive output, but all in all, import wise, we dont have a specific weak link
And unbelievably, like you say, we're actually still in the title race!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2020 16:16:24 GMT
Let's be honest. He is too good for this league and there hasnt been many players over here from any team you could generally say that about I bet us having a player of Herrs ability is killing simmsy right now! The likes of Connelly vallerand deluca dont even come close "lets be honest" pidge he is far from the best player both in actual figures and pedigree to grace these shores or even grace the panthers. This season he has been very good for panthers but perhaps he is perceived to be better than he actually is due to the lack of quality in the rest of the bunch, afterall how long do you think Rheault would have been a steelers player given the lack of pretty much anything over the last two seasons. This is a team game and although Herr's individual stats are brilliant this means nothing if ultimately he leaves at the end of the season and nothing is won. Yes right now this far into the season it would seem imperative that his signature is secured for next season and a better team can be built around him but if as this season the ship is sunk for an halpeth o tar then its all academic isn't it. At the start of the season it was clear that the cash was splashed a lot in Sheffield who were very closely followed by Cardiff and Belfast with the quality within those squads and I too don't buy the but xxxxxx really wanted to play for us so bad he is on a bag of nuts and free sticks. Most people were predicting a 4th place team with those 3 leading the way and to be honest I really don't see any difference even now even with Herr on fire. To be challenging and unbelievably its still not too late (not very often we have said that about panthers in January) the team really do need to lose at least a player if not more of dead wood and get in quality and then come the run in who knows may even win it but the will to do whats necessary has to be seen within the club and if the team get a result this weekend I doubt very much that will is there... afterall a continental cup can be seen as a successful season without spending another penny... Tex.. forget his pedigree and stats.. watch the player.. name me a player who has had a bigger impact in his first 5 months than Herr. Who's been a better defensive forward, better leader, generally more complete than him? After all that waffle you barely praised Panthers at all! Thank yourself lucky Panthers are still challenging..tbh I put us above Belfast now as legit challengers so that's top 3!!
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Post by bobness on Jan 7, 2020 17:47:54 GMT
How many other players have Cardiff held onto who could play at higher levels? I can think of several. Fournier could surely play at a higher level than in Cardiff. Genuinely, on what basis do you say that? He's a player who never got near the NHL, never really stuck in the A, and played the majority of his games in the ECHL. CV wise, plenty far better than that have played in the EIHL. He had a career year last year with an insane +/-, but is nowhere near repeating it this year. He does seem to like Cardiff though. I don't think he's anywhere near (say) DEL level though? Sam Jardine has a similar CV to Fournier, and this year is outshining him defensively, leading the Devils at +13, to Fournier's +1. Mark Louis and McMonagle are both -11.
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iginla
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Post by iginla on Jan 7, 2020 18:09:37 GMT
Fournier could surely play at a higher level than in Cardiff. Genuinely, on what basis do you say that? He's a player who never got near the NHL, never really stuck in the A, and played the majority of his games in the ECHL. CV wise, plenty far better than that have played in the EIHL. He had a career year last year with an insane +/-, but is nowhere near repeating it this year. He does seem to like Cardiff though. I don't think he's anywhere near (say) DEL level though? Sam Jardine has a similar CV to Fournier, and this year is outshining him defensively, leading the Devils at +13, to Fournier's +1. Mark Louis and McMonagle are both -11. Based on what he’s done in the EIHL over several years and he’s a great skater too. If he can outshine other EIHL players who have played in better leagues then why would Fournier not be able to play in those same leagues. People are saying Herr could play in better leagues based on exactly that....what he’s doing in the EIHL.
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Post by bobness on Jan 7, 2020 18:30:09 GMT
Genuinely, on what basis do you say that? He's a player who never got near the NHL, never really stuck in the A, and played the majority of his games in the ECHL. CV wise, plenty far better than that have played in the EIHL. He had a career year last year with an insane +/-, but is nowhere near repeating it this year. He does seem to like Cardiff though. I don't think he's anywhere near (say) DEL level though? Sam Jardine has a similar CV to Fournier, and this year is outshining him defensively, leading the Devils at +13, to Fournier's +1. Mark Louis and McMonagle are both -11. Based on what he’s done in the EIHL over several years and he’s a great skater too. If he can outshine other EIHL players who have played in better leagues then why would Fournier not be able to play in those same leagues. People are saying Herr could play in better leagues based on exactly that....what he’s doing in the EIHL. So, why haven't the big bucks come his way? They do for most who are "too good". Kyle Baun, for example, Yann Sauve and others. Does he really like it in Cardiff that much? To be fair, his only "great" year (stats wise) was last year. 17-18 he wasn't even Devils' top scoring D man, let alone anything more. Lots of players are great skaters. He's good, but that good?
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Jord v4
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Post by Jord v4 on Jan 7, 2020 18:54:18 GMT
Herr is on the 2nd year optional contract if all parties are happy.... Also has the EIHL 'protection'.
Means very little imo as we can easily be outbid by loads of non EIHL teams/leagues.
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Post by Bagheera on Jan 7, 2020 19:05:31 GMT
Herr is on the 2nd year optional contract if all parties are happy.... Also has the EIHL 'protection'. Means very little imo as we can easily be outbid by loads of non EIHL teams/leagues. The EIHL protection is good to here. I'll be fine with all involved if he leaves at the end of the season. The only way i'll have a beef with the club is if he ended up at another EIHL club. He is clearly a good player and has time to go better himself. Certainly not a player winding down his career. All comes down to what his ambitions are though in reality. So many factors come into it, but it's going to be almost certain he will get better offers with the numbers he is putting up. If those offers are AHL or equivalent in europe then he will surely go. If the offers are only marginally better, but he is happy here with all the other factors that come with playing in europe(language/culture etc) then maybe we could just hang on to him. This weekend could be pivital. Win the CC and get a CHL spot and that could just be enough to persuade him back, And maybe Neil Black to dig a bit deeper too.
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iginla
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Post by iginla on Jan 7, 2020 19:06:51 GMT
Herr is on the 2nd year optional contract if all parties are happy.... Also has the EIHL 'protection'. Means very little imo as we can easily be outbid by loads of non EIHL teams/leagues. So if Herr wants to go his second year contract is basically a complete waste of time. At the end of the day if Panthers wanted to compete with say the DEL they could.....offer him £3k a week and that would be compatible with a good mid to upper range DEL salary. Sounds a lot but £3k a week is nothing to Panthers.
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ant
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Post by ant on Jan 7, 2020 19:15:57 GMT
Ling shone in a better team. I’d have him as number 1. The fact that we are worried about Herr going tells you all you need about the club’s lack of ambition and failure to keep good players over the years. We either don’t treat them well enough eg Craighead or have even allowed returning players like Tess or Adey to go elsewhere (and in fact to our rivals) . Similarly, keeping poor players like Rheault doesn’t happen with the three teams who regularly compete. If Panthers were serious about the league, we’d be upgrading to close the gap. We aren’t.
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iginla
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Post by iginla on Jan 7, 2020 19:20:28 GMT
Based on what he’s done in the EIHL over several years and he’s a great skater too. If he can outshine other EIHL players who have played in better leagues then why would Fournier not be able to play in those same leagues. People are saying Herr could play in better leagues based on exactly that....what he’s doing in the EIHL. So, why haven't the big bucks come his way? They do for most who are "too good". Kyle Baun, for example, Yann Sauve and others. Does he really like it in Cardiff that much? To be fair, his only "great" year (stats wise) was last year. 17-18 he wasn't even Devils' top scoring D man, let alone anything more. Lots of players are great skaters. He's good, but that good? Bigger bucks may well have already come Fourniers way but it depends what Cardiff pay him doesn’t it. Along with Martin and Bowns I should think Fournier is one of the last players the Devils would want to lose so I’d guess he’s got to be on top end EIHL money.
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Jord v4
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Post by Jord v4 on Jan 7, 2020 20:19:13 GMT
Herr is on the 2nd year optional contract if all parties are happy.... Also has the EIHL 'protection'. Means very little imo as we can easily be outbid by loads of non EIHL teams/leagues. So if Herr wants to go his second year contract is basically a complete waste of time. At the end of the day if Panthers wanted to compete with say the DEL they could.....offer him £3k a week and that would be compatible with a good mid to upper range DEL salary. Sounds a lot but £3k a week is nothing to Panthers. He can't go to another EIHL team in theory, although we know this does still happen... The pay off would have to be pretty significant. Panthers could offer him more to stay away from other leagues. But can we compete with AHL or SHL for example, no chance.
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iginla
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Post by iginla on Jan 7, 2020 21:07:44 GMT
So if Herr wants to go his second year contract is basically a complete waste of time. At the end of the day if Panthers wanted to compete with say the DEL they could.....offer him £3k a week and that would be compatible with a good mid to upper range DEL salary. Sounds a lot but £3k a week is nothing to Panthers. He can't go to another EIHL team in theory, although we know this does still happen... The pay off would have to be pretty significant. Panthers could offer him more to stay away from other leagues. But can we compete with AHL or SHL for example, no chance. If an SHL,AHL or Swiss A team wants to come in and offer him real big money then no he isn’t staying in Nottingham. But if you look at the sort of salary range in most other Euro leagues then there’s no reason Panthers couldn’t compete IF they wanted to. Take the DEL for example,the salary range is 45,000 - 160,000 Euro’s and I wouldn’t think Herr would walk into that league as a real top end earning player.
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Post by wgray on Jan 8, 2020 0:23:12 GMT
Herr is a prime example of a player we should be offering an MBA to, as well as paying him as much as we possibly can.
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Post by jdizpt8 on Jan 8, 2020 10:03:02 GMT
CHL hockey and Education could be a great retainer. Have to get it done this weekend and wait till the off season I guess. Keeping Hansen and Talbot should be a priority as well and I’d like to think discussions have already been had. D is good also and Carr I think has been much better than most thought when announced. Hopefully retain the core and Add quality around them.
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Pies
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Post by Pies on Jan 8, 2020 19:02:28 GMT
A lot of people are talking about who we should sign back and build for next season....you know who no one has mentioned...Tim Wallace.
I was fully sceptical of his appointment. I was calling for his head in October. But for me, he’s proven his skill set as a coach, as a tactician and for us playing entertaining hockey. Fact is after an 10 plus game losing streak and a horrible start, were still in the league hunt in January is excellent. He’s really turned us around.
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