There's bad, and then there's worse...?

[Shaggy]

Here's a thought...

This season has been poor for the Panthers - I doubt that there's anyone out there who truly believes otherwise (ignoring club PRs... they'll always put a good spin on it, nature of the beast).
At best you'd call it wildly inconsistent, at worst... well, I'd have to moderate myself if I repeated any of them!

And yet we end up 3rd out of 11.
W T actual F ??

If we're bad - what the hell has everyone else been? Apart from Belfast & Cardiff, of course...

Most notably, if we've been "wildly inconsistent", then the Steelers have been... what's worse that "wildly"? Despite a recent bit of a rally (including their one and only win over Cardiff this season) they have been noticeably worse than us... which would be hilarious, except that they've been bad except when facing us. Go figure.

And yet the league title is only going to be decided on the very last weekend of the league, and - as things stand right now - only 9 points separate 4th and 10th places.
Is the league more competitive than previously? Less competitive? More messed up? Less messed up?

Does anyone out there have any real clue* as to what the hell is going on? Because I sure don't...


* By that, I mean a real clue, based on evidence and logic... not the usual prejudices, agendas and conspiracy theories that rely more on volume of rhetoric than actual thought.

[John Casey]

To be honest, for the 1st 2 games against The Steelers we beat them convincingly.

Also I think some teams went on a hot streak and then gone on a cold streak e.g. what is happening to Glasgow.

Maybe the extra points teams winning in Overtime made things closer

[kievthegreat]

It's a bit of an odd one this year because Belfast have kept it so tight. For instance, if Belfast end up winning their last 3 games (which I'd expect they should if they are taking it to the wire), they'd end up with a better record than Cardiff managed when they dominated last year (0.767 vs 0.759). There have been other very tight seasons, but usually the top 2 sides have ended up with substantially fewer points. The only exceptiopn is 2010/11 where Steelers, Devils and Giants all had ridiculously good records (0.806, 0.806 & 0.796), that year though you had the Vipers and Capitals losing 90 of their 102 games against the rest of the league feeding the points frenzy and no conferences to shield the weaker teams from being obliterated. Obviously we've lost the proper conferences, but while MK are poor this year, but they are lightyears away from that sort of level.

Also 'fun' Panthers fact, they've now finished 4th in our conference 4 years running. Note that 15/16 & 16/17 season had the old 5 team Erhardt so we beat Coventry, since then we've been last 3 years running. Equally deprerssing is that on a points percentage AND on the distance to 3rd, this is our best conference performance in the last 4 years.

[Carnell]

Inconstancy has been our issue, we won our series against Cardiff 3-1-0-2, yet Sheffield beat us 2-4-0-2 and we never beat Fife in regulation this season finishing 0-2-3-1 against them.

Cardiff and MK are the only teams that we went 3-0 at home.

I think the league has been competitive this season, with the league still undecided going into the final weekend and the final playoff spot could go to three teams. Sheffield started off shockingly, but made plenty of changes and managed to get their selves into a playoff spot, where we all know anything can happen.

I think the biggest saving grace for us this season is that we have taken so many games to OT (mainly throwing away leads), gaining (or losing) valuable extra points.

We have lost 18 in regulation, Belfast have lost 13 so only 5 games difference, but they have won 36 games in regulation and 6 in OT/PS compared to our 23 regulation wins and 6 OT/PS wins (29 in total), that's the same overall wins as Sheffield, Fife, Guildford and one less than Glasgow. For comparison, Manchester have 26 wins and Coventry have 25 wins.

5 losses more doesn't sound too bad against Belfast considering how poor our season has been, but then when you compare the fact we have won 23 regulation games to Belfast's 36, you see our problem

[bobness]

You make a compelling point, Shaggy.

A season that most (on here) consider a "disaster", and the team end up third in the league. One place above their "normal" fourth... ( ) and leading the chasing pack behind the 2 best teams by a mile. Yes, many think that Panthers "should" be one of the teams contending, and that may be a reasonable view, but it's hardly a disaster, is it? Bottom half would be less than good, but third?
The league is very competitive this year, even MK, who are well adrift, haven't got that bad a record, especially considering their woes, and are/were capable of beating any side on any night.

[Gilly]

I personally don't take positions into account, we're highly unlikely to never reach the playoffs so league positions i dont worry too much about.

The thing we should be monitoring ourselves against is how many points behind first did we finish, this should be our benchmark.

18/19 21pts with games to go
17/18 14pts
16/17 23pts
15/16 10pts
14/15 9pts
13/14 32pts

a pretty average season looking at that, which i'd suggest was about right

[Deleted]

Anything more than 10 points is bloody awful. Mind you I'm seeing yet again plenty of snowflakes on Twitter last night hailing the fact we've all but clinched 3rd... 16 points behind 2nd 🙄 jesus

[spik]

Something I was too pointing out on the 'fixtures thread' when I made a comment in adding the latest notes.
Oddly in a poor season, we (assumably) finished 3rd. One point that the club will point towards.
Next years spin...'if we're bad and finish third, wait till next season - get your tickets now.'

But bar our plight, it's been a good league for the Elite as a) no total runaway leader.
b) positions have changed.

Though a league will generally have eg) soccers main 7 at the top, the newer teams at the bottom. Just that we wished teams would have more varying seasons. Teams like MK to do well another. But then it's where we came in here, we had a poor one and finished 3rd? So nothing to moan about...but.....

[The Flying Shirt]

3rd = second loser

[iginla]

Mar 25, 2019 10:38:26 GMT Gilly said:

I personally don't take positions into account, we're highly unlikely to never reach the playoffs so league positions i dont worry too much about.

The thing we should be monitoring ourselves against is how many points behind first did we finish, this should be our benchmark.

18/19 21pts with games to go
17/18 14pts
16/17 23pts
15/16 10pts
14/15 9pts
13/14 32pts

a pretty average season looking at that, which i'd suggest was about right

All i can say about that six year record is it’s absolutely appalling !
It’s the record of a distinctly average mid budget team.

[bobness]

Mar 25, 2019 15:41:00 GMT iginla said:

Mar 25, 2019 10:38:26 GMT Gilly said:

I personally don't take positions into account, we're highly unlikely to never reach the playoffs so league positions i dont worry too much about.

The thing we should be monitoring ourselves against is how many points behind first did we finish, this should be our benchmark.

18/19 21pts with games to go
17/18 14pts
16/17 23pts
15/16 10pts
14/15 9pts
13/14 32pts

a pretty average season looking at that, which i'd suggest was about right

All i can say about that six year record is it’s absolutely appalling !
It’s the record of a distinctly average mid budget team.

With too many quiz nights and a drinking club/holiday camp atmosphere, don't forget.

[shinobi]

Yay for third!!!

[iginla]

Mar 25, 2019 16:01:52 GMT bobness said:

Mar 25, 2019 15:41:00 GMT iginla said:

All i can say about that six year record is it’s absolutely appalling !
It’s the record of a distinctly average mid budget team.

With too many quiz nights and a drinking club/holiday camp atmosphere, don't forget.

Yup
An average of 18 points behind the winners over six seasons.
Quite pathetic for a team the size of Panthers. 🙄

[pantherlee]

Mar 25, 2019 15:41:00 GMT iginla said:

Mar 25, 2019 10:38:26 GMT Gilly said:

I personally don't take positions into account, we're highly unlikely to never reach the playoffs so league positions i dont worry too much about.

The thing we should be monitoring ourselves against is how many points behind first did we finish, this should be our benchmark.

18/19 21pts with games to go
17/18 14pts
16/17 23pts
15/16 10pts
14/15 9pts
13/14 32pts

a pretty average season looking at that, which i'd suggest was about right

All i can say about that six year record is it’s absolutely appalling !
It’s the record of a distinctly average mid budget team.

It is pretty abysmal. We've only had one really good team in that time which was 15/16. We could have had a grand slam that season if we hadn't faffed around not getting a replacement for Wiikman for 2-3 months when he kept getting injured and relying on Dan Green. That for imo is what cost us the league that season

[Mark]

Apart from Cardiff and Belfast the league has been very poor. Being top of the dung heap is not something to brag about.

[Yotes]

It is strange we're third, but I think that says more about the other 8 really.

I don't remember last year fondly, but this lot still need something from the Guildford game to not end up with fewer points than that team managed, and that's with the even league, and 4 more games.

[wgray]

Mar 25, 2019 18:38:51 GMT pantherlee said:

Mar 25, 2019 15:41:00 GMT iginla said:

All i can say about that six year record is it’s absolutely appalling !
It’s the record of a distinctly average mid budget team.

It is pretty abysmal. We've only had one really good team in that time which was 15/16. We could have had a grand slam that season if we hadn't faffed around not getting a replacement for Wiikman for 2-3 months when he kept getting injured and relying on Dan Green. That for imo is what cost us the league that season

Agreed, we had a good team to finish that season. But, the same as the grand slam season, we let far too many players leave and didn’t retain a solid core to build on. Kolnik, Janssen, Bohmbach, MacDonald, Quick, Ling, Mosey, Myers all gone after 15/16.

Cardiff have the blueprint we should be following.

[Deleted]

It's a poor league and the standard across the board is average at best. I cringe when I hear the standard is getting better, it really isn't folks. It may be getting more competitive and closer in terms of all teams taking points off each other yes but not of a better standard.

[Shaggy]

Mar 25, 2019 20:50:21 GMT wgray said:

Mar 25, 2019 18:38:51 GMT pantherlee said:

It is pretty abysmal. We've only had one really good team in that time which was 15/16. We could have had a grand slam that season if we hadn't faffed around not getting a replacement for Wiikman for 2-3 months when he kept getting injured and relying on Dan Green. That for imo is what cost us the league that season

Agreed, we had a good team to finish that season. But, the same as the grand slam season, we let far too many players leave and didn’t retain a solid core to build on. Kolnik, Janssen, Bohmbach, MacDonald, Quick, Ling, Mosey, Myers all gone after 15/16.

Cardiff have the blueprint we should be following.

But that doesn't fit too well with annual "the whole team is rubbish, bin the lot of them" baying herd, does it?

[bobness]

Mar 25, 2019 20:50:21 GMT wgray said:

Mar 25, 2019 18:38:51 GMT pantherlee said:

It is pretty abysmal. We've only had one really good team in that time which was 15/16. We could have had a grand slam that season if we hadn't faffed around not getting a replacement for Wiikman for 2-3 months when he kept getting injured and relying on Dan Green. That for imo is what cost us the league that season

Agreed, we had a good team to finish that season. But, the same as the grand slam season, we let far too many players leave and didn’t retain a solid core to build on. Kolnik, Janssen, Bohmbach, MacDonald, Quick, Ling, Mosey, Myers all gone after 15/16.

Cardiff have the blueprint we should be following.

Kolnik went back to Quebec to play semi-pro, Janssen retired, Bohmbach retired, Ling couldn't play another full season, Quick played one more year in China, (getting thrashed every weekend) then retired, Mosey went to the A and MacDonald retired. Not sure we "let them leave"?

Schultz came back and did OK, Moran came back to be something of a disappointment.

The only bright spark in that season was McGratton, his line, and that goal vs Fitzy and the Steelers.

[bobness]

Mar 25, 2019 20:51:42 GMT @pidge said:

It's a poor league and the standard across the board is average at best. I cringe when I hear the standard is getting better, it really isn't folks. It may be getting more competitive and closer in terms of all teams taking points off each other yes but not of a better standard.

Genuinely Pidge, what do you base this opinion on?
You don't even go to Panthers games any more, do you?
Let alone benchmark the league to others?

I've been watching the "old" highlights of games on Freesports and the pace is laughable compared to what you get these days.
Players like Linglet, Baun, Olsen, Byers and others have way better hockey histories than anyone playing EIHL 10 years ago. 10 years ago, Hurtubise led the league in points per game and Greg Chambers scored 72 points...
The EIHL is way better a league now. I can barely imagine a 2008-09 EIHL team winning a face off against a CHL team, let alone qualifying for the next round.

[wgray]

Mar 25, 2019 20:45:34 GMT Yotes said:

It is strange we're third, but I think that says more about the other 8 really.

I don't remember last year fondly, but this lot still need something from the Guildford game to not end up with fewer points than that team managed, and that's with the even league, and 4 more games.

Points percentage wise, this years team is worse than last seasons. The hockey has been absolutely abysmal this year though and that’s what I think has pushed a lot of people to the edge, it’s just been draining.

Last season, our league form swan-dived in December, but at least we had the highs of the CHL. What I’d give for something like that this season. To re-live the Bern home game, Mokshantsev’s magic, Brown skating zone-to-zone and finding the top corner. Or the two legs against Zurich, the passion from our fans was unbelievable, I’ve never heard noise like it. Spine-tingling.

What have we had this season, some good victories against Cardiff but apart from that what have we had to be excited about?

I’m praying to god this team can see the light and commit themselves in the play-offs. Let’s see some emotion and passion on the ice, a desire to win.

[Deleted]

Mar 25, 2019 21:19:49 GMT bobness said:

Mar 25, 2019 20:51:42 GMT @pidge said:

It's a poor league and the standard across the board is average at best. I cringe when I hear the standard is getting better, it really isn't folks. It may be getting more competitive and closer in terms of all teams taking points off each other yes but not of a better standard.

Genuinely Pidge, what do you base this opinion on?
You don't even go to Panthers games any more, do you?
Let alone benchmark the league to others?

I've been watching the "old" highlights of games on Freesports and the pace is laughable compared to what you get these days.
Players like Linglet, Baun, Olsen, Byers and others have way better hockey histories than anyone playing EIHL 10 years ago. 10 years ago, Hurtubise led the league in points per game and Greg Chambers scored 72 points...
The EIHL is way better a league now. I can barely imagine a 2008-09 EIHL team winning a face off against a CHL team, let alone qualifying for the next round.

Try watching a superleague game and get back to me... I ll wait

The likes of Joey Martin may have scrapped into the 4th line back then if they were lucky . Some back up goalies were better than starting netties now, and it was entertaining!!!!

[wgray]

Mar 25, 2019 21:10:33 GMT Shaggy said:

Mar 25, 2019 20:50:21 GMT wgray said:

Agreed, we had a good team to finish that season. But, the same as the grand slam season, we let far too many players leave and didn’t retain a solid core to build on. Kolnik, Janssen, Bohmbach, MacDonald, Quick, Ling, Mosey, Myers all gone after 15/16.

Cardiff have the blueprint we should be following.

But that doesn't fit too well with annual "the whole team is rubbish, bin the lot of them" baying herd, does it?

People get carried away Shaggy, we all do. There are definitely players in every team though who you must retain and build from, there are some of those in this current team.

[wgray]

Mar 25, 2019 21:11:43 GMT bobness said:

Mar 25, 2019 20:50:21 GMT wgray said:

Agreed, we had a good team to finish that season. But, the same as the grand slam season, we let far too many players leave and didn’t retain a solid core to build on. Kolnik, Janssen, Bohmbach, MacDonald, Quick, Ling, Mosey, Myers all gone after 15/16.

Cardiff have the blueprint we should be following.

Kolnik went back to Quebec to play semi-pro, Janssen retired, Bohmbach retired, Ling couldn't play another full season, Quick played one more year in China, (getting thrashed every weekend) then retired, Mosey went to the A and MacDonald retired. Not sure we "let them leave"?

Schultz came back and did OK, Moran came back to be something of a disappointment.

The only bright spark in that season was McGratton, his line, and that goal vs Fitzy and the Steelers.

All I’ll say is money talks. Ok, Janssen and Mosey may not have been tempted but I’m sure the others would have been influenced. Do you agree we need to keep a good core from this season?