Yotes
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Post by Yotes on Mar 9, 2019 22:55:30 GMT
First two periods we totally dominated, some decent stuff in between the usual grind. 3rd the game sort of stopped, might as well have sent us home early. Munson played quite well, although a better offence would've cleaned him up with some of the rebounds he left on his doorstep. Dundee were terrible. Even players who have shown decent quality at our place before looked way off it. I was at least expecting a desperate effort, they're on the bubble for the playoff race, but there was nothing there at all. Didn't make for much of a spectacle for me. (until next Sunday anyway) This is a depressingly accurate comment on checking the fixture list. Our run in could've been really good for a league challenge, but as it is...
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Post by kievthegreat on Mar 9, 2019 22:59:33 GMT
Just hope the rumours aren’t true and we see Dundee again next season. Moving league, winding up? Can't say I've heard any rumours about Stars.
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Post by PantherG on Mar 9, 2019 23:57:27 GMT
Moving league, winding up? Can't say I've heard any rumours about Stars. Me neither...
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Post by ashfieldpanther on Mar 10, 2019 7:24:06 GMT
Surprising amount of checks thrown by us last night. Hope it wasnt just because Dundee dont have a recognised fighter so couldnt do much to respond. Maybe we are gearing up for playoffs ?
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Post by bobness on Mar 10, 2019 9:49:07 GMT
Surprising amount of checks thrown by us last night. Hope it wasnt just because Dundee dont have a recognised fighter so couldnt do much to respond. Maybe we are gearing up for playoffs ? Nice to see Bill stand up and be counted, but again, a fight after a hard, but legal, check. I don't see anyone saying it was a duff check? Anyway... Some random musings. Dundee were a shadow of the side that played here earlier in the season. Some interesting body language on the bench when the goal was washed out. I thought they did well to avoid a misconduct. Stewart is starting to look the kind of player he should be. That line 55/19/9 looks very dangerous. Since being put together in what looks like game 47, 3 Feb in Belfast, in 9 games they've scored 4+6, 3+7 and 4+4 respectively. Farmer and Perlini seem to have good chemistry with the right third man (first Shalla last season and now Stewart). Dylan Richard looked a different player last night, on the 21/26 line in place of Guptill. His first point since 10 Feb, and a good, solid, hardworking game.. Compare and contrast to putting the league's second top goalscorer on the 4th line with a player who's scored a goal in one game out of 54 previous this season. I'm stumped by that, I'd love to know the reasoning. Has Guptill blotted his copybook in practice or off-ice? His current 3 game pointless streak is (jointly) his second longest of the season. Pither has 8 points in his last 5 games up to last night, Farmer 8 in his last 6 (at least a point in all 5/6 games). Longest all season is Guptill with an 8 game streak. Prior to being scratched last night, Kovacs had 6 points in his last 15 games, before that he'd had 17 points in 13 games. I presume he's injured, anyone know?
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Post by The Flying Shirt on Mar 10, 2019 12:16:18 GMT
Just hope the rumours aren’t true and we see Dundee again next season. Moving league, winding up? Can't say I've heard any rumours about Stars. I know for a fact that at least three teams are looking for a cheaper option going forwards and one team being rumored to be coming up don't see that as a realistic option at all. Employing, housing and flying fourteen imports and interest just isn't growing. Just look at some of the attendance figures this season for teams that rely on genuine ice hockey fans opposed to night out walk ups. The leap now between pretty much pay to play ice hockey and and an arena team wage and housing bill is huge. I think there will be big changes in the off season and a lot of it going on behind closed doors. We might possibly see another Braehead type formation or a lot of support from the richer teams (of which there are possibly only two) but the fact is that interest has to grow and in it's present form you are going to be seeing less teams going forwards and another option being put into place.
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Post by John Casey on Mar 10, 2019 14:08:13 GMT
Moving league, winding up? Can't say I've heard any rumours about Stars. I know for a fact that at least three teams are looking for a cheaper option going forwards and one team being rumored to be coming up don't see that as a realistic option at all. Employing, housing and flying fourteen imports and interest just isn't growing. Just look at some of the attendance figures this season for teams that rely on genuine ice hockey fans opposed to night out walk ups. The leap now between pretty much pay to play ice hockey and and an arena team wage and housing bill is huge. I think there will be big changes in the off season and a lot of it going on behind closed doors. We might possibly see another Braehead type formation or a lot of support from the richer teams (of which there are possibly only two) but the fact is that interest has to grow and in it's present form you are going to be seeing less teams going forwards and another option being put into place. Could you see English teams in this new league wanting to go to Scotland. I may be wrong but didn't a Scottish team want to join the EPL but were refused?
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Pies
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Post by Pies on Mar 10, 2019 14:21:12 GMT
I actually quite enjoyed the game. The effort was led by Bolduc's line. The more I watch him, the more I'm impressed by him
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Post by ashfieldpanther on Mar 10, 2019 14:26:04 GMT
I actually quite enjoyed the game. The effort was led by Bolduc's line. The more I watch him, the more I'm impressed by him He's certainly much improved and finally living up to his cv.
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Post by wgray on Mar 10, 2019 14:27:51 GMT
Moving league, winding up? Can't say I've heard any rumours about Stars. I know for a fact that at least three teams are looking for a cheaper option going forwards and one team being rumored to be coming up don't see that as a realistic option at all. Employing, housing and flying fourteen imports and interest just isn't growing. Just look at some of the attendance figures this season for teams that rely on genuine ice hockey fans opposed to night out walk ups. The leap now between pretty much pay to play ice hockey and and an arena team wage and housing bill is huge. I think there will be big changes in the off season and a lot of it going on behind closed doors. We might possibly see another Braehead type formation or a lot of support from the richer teams (of which there are possibly only two) but the fact is that interest has to grow and in it's present form you are going to be seeing less teams going forwards and another option being put into place. So, I ask you this, how do we make the game more interesting? I believe, for regular fans who already have the bug, the first thing that would generate interest is a league with more teams where we play each other on a less regular basis. For fans who don’t have the hockey bug I believe that we need to see Hockey that is physical, aggressive, controversial and has an element of animosity to it. The vision that Tony Smith has and has tried implementing in Sheffield doesn’t work at the sports current point of growth. Sheffield are supposed to be a fast and skilful team that is exciting to watch, but they’re not, and as Sheffied fans have stated they aren’t entertaining. For fast and skilful to be entertaining we need to see elite level players but we don’t have the money for that. The sport is a minority one, to grow and attract new fans who keep coming back we need to see characters, fights, big hits, violence, big scorelines. Everyone loves this. In turn it will be more entertaining, there will be genuine rivalries developing that add to the attraction and people will be looking forward to coming back. As a league we are being led down the wrong route imo and I’m puzzled that the people in charge can’t see it.
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Yotes
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Post by Yotes on Mar 10, 2019 14:58:05 GMT
So, I ask you this, how do we make the game more interesting? I think the bigger problem for a lot of fanbases is that they know they'll not challenge for anything. They might make the playoff quarterfinals, they might make a Challenge Cup semifinal (Guildford says "Oi!" at this point), but in all likelihood they aren't going to win anything. That stuff goes to one of four teams. So if you exist to make up the numbers, what's the point? We're not going to get a violent game back, the sport as a whole has changed. I doubt many players want to be in an overly physical league. Personally I think only artificial leveling - wage cap - which will upset Iggy enormously, is the only way to produce a league that keeps everyone interested.
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Post by The Flying Shirt on Mar 10, 2019 15:18:26 GMT
I know for a fact that at least three teams are looking for a cheaper option going forwards and one team being rumored to be coming up don't see that as a realistic option at all. Employing, housing and flying fourteen imports and interest just isn't growing. Just look at some of the attendance figures this season for teams that rely on genuine ice hockey fans opposed to night out walk ups. The leap now between pretty much pay to play ice hockey and and an arena team wage and housing bill is huge. I think there will be big changes in the off season and a lot of it going on behind closed doors. We might possibly see another Braehead type formation or a lot of support from the richer teams (of which there are possibly only two) but the fact is that interest has to grow and in it's present form you are going to be seeing less teams going forwards and another option being put into place. So, I ask you this, how do we make the game more interesting? I believe, for regular fans who already have the bug, the first thing that would generate interest is a league with more teams where we play each other on a less regular basis. For fans who don’t have the hockey bug I believe that we need to see Hockey that is physical, aggressive, controversial and has an element of animosity to it. The vision that Tony Smith has and has tried implementing in Sheffield doesn’t work at the sports current point of growth. Sheffield are supposed to be a fast and skilful team that is exciting to watch, but they’re not, and as Sheffied fans have stated they aren’t entertaining. For fast and skilful to be entertaining we need to see elite level players but we don’t have the money for that. The sport is a minority one, to grow and attract new fans who keep coming back we need to see characters, fights, big hits, violence, big scorelines. Everyone loves this. In turn it will be more entertaining, there will be genuine rivalries developing that add to the attraction and people will be looking forward to coming back. As a league we are being led down the wrong route imo and I’m puzzled that the people in charge can’t see it. Bigger leagues around the world than ours are in deep trouble and some very big teams have gone. The British ice hockey fan base is very small and to keep up a decent level of ice hockey costs a lot of money. It's a minority sport here and like the Panthers have found if you don't go after "night out" bums on seats it's just not viable as a sustainable business. Not enough suitable venues, not enough ice time and the bottom line just not enough fans. Not sure about appealing to a wider audience either. Tons of free tickets given out but unless more free tickets come along I don't think a lot come back. It's also a very easy habit to break as loads of long time season ticket holders just drift away and never even think about the game again. It is a minority sport and thats not going to change and a minority sport cant keep up the level to keep enough people interested. The sport needs sponsors and that needs mainstream television time. I just can't see enough people being interested.
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iginla
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Post by iginla on Mar 10, 2019 15:45:39 GMT
So, I ask you this, how do we make the game more interesting? I think the bigger problem for a lot of fanbases is that they know they'll not challenge for anything. They might make the playoff quarterfinals, they might make a Challenge Cup semifinal (Guildford says "Oi!" at this point), but in all likelihood they aren't going to win anything. That stuff goes to one of four teams. So if you exist to make up the numbers, what's the point? We're not going to get a violent game back, the sport as a whole has changed. I doubt many players want to be in an overly physical league. Personally I think only artificial leveling - wage cap - which will upset Iggy enormously, is the only way to produce a league that keeps everyone interested. Mmmmm I thought Panthers already tried their very best to create an artificially level league. 🤨 If they didn’t there wouldn’t be “four teams” there would be one. I agree they’ve shot themselves in the foot now taking the supposed skilled less violent hockey route. Crowds are stagnating or dropping on what they were,Panthers are down,Coventry miles down,Fife down,Braehead down,Manchester Dundee and Giants seem pretty static, Steelers are up boosted by these £5 tickets no doubt plus no Ice Sheffield games now. Makes you wonder where the EIHL will be in say three years time.
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Yotes
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Post by Yotes on Mar 10, 2019 15:54:41 GMT
Told you it'd upset you We might be matched with the Erhardt teams, but with the other 7 it's night and day. I don't think a move away from physical hockey is a route, I don't think there's any other option. It's just the way they're all going. You might have a few obscure holdouts somewhere in Canada, but by and large I bet all leagues are on the same path. Summer will be interesting with this new NIHL league in the picture.
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Shaggy
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Post by Shaggy on Mar 10, 2019 16:05:01 GMT
The first and biggest problem in attracting people to the sport - and I'm talking country-wide here, not just Nottingham - is not whether it meets anyone's desired levels of speed/skill/punch-ups/whatever... but simple awareness. There are simply too few people who know anything about the sport - that it even exists in this country, that there's a team near them, etc etc. Even those who are aware that a team may exist in their area simply don't know anything about it.
I work in sales, and I speak to a lot of people - customers and suppliers - all over the country, day in and day out. So many people know nothing about the sport or the teams... even when right on their doorstep. "Isn't there a team called the Steelers near here? Where do they play?" "The sport can't be very big, we never see it on the telly" "Isn't it just a bunch of Americans?" (no, many people still don't know the difference...) "How come there's never anything in the news about it?" "Watching the ice hockey at the Winter Olympics was fun... is it like that over here?" "Isn't it just a load of fights?" (And an old favourite for years):- "There's a rink in Edinburgh? What - next to Murrayfield? And there's an ice hockey team??" Etc etc.
I have literally been hearing that kind of thing for nearly 20 years now. Nothing has changed.
Before anything else, if you want to bring people into the sport... you have to educate them and inform them. Way too little is done in that regard. Of course, the fundamental structural problems in British ice make that so much harder... incompetent and fractured governing bodies, mercenary rink/arena operators, self-centred leagues and owners, puritanical fans who at one and the same time complain about 'Saturday-nighters' and ' too many kids/families' then moan that there aren't enough new fans, and so on...
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Post by The Flying Shirt on Mar 10, 2019 16:16:05 GMT
I think the bigger problem for a lot of fanbases is that they know they'll not challenge for anything. They might make the playoff quarterfinals, they might make a Challenge Cup semifinal (Guildford says "Oi!" at this point), but in all likelihood they aren't going to win anything. That stuff goes to one of four teams. So if you exist to make up the numbers, what's the point? We're not going to get a violent game back, the sport as a whole has changed. I doubt many players want to be in an overly physical league. Personally I think only artificial leveling - wage cap - which will upset Iggy enormously, is the only way to produce a league that keeps everyone interested. Mmmmm I thought Panthers already tried their very best to create an artificially level league. 🤨 If they didn’t there wouldn’t be “four teams” there would be one. I agree they’ve shot themselves in the foot now taking the supposed skilled less violent hockey route. Crowds are stagnating or dropping on what they were,Panthers are down,Coventry miles down,Fife down,Braehead down,Manchester Dundee and Giants seem pretty static, Steelers are up boosted by these £5 tickets no doubt plus no Ice Sheffield games now. Makes you wonder where the EIHL will be in say three years time. Well without TV Dancing on Ice would be small crowd at the Blackpool Tower in holiday season
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Post by NickThePanther44 on Mar 16, 2019 8:34:00 GMT
So, I ask you this, how do we make the game more interesting? I think the bigger problem for a lot of fanbases is that they know they'll not challenge for anything. They might make the playoff quarterfinals, they might make a Challenge Cup semifinal (Guildford says "Oi!" at this point), but in all likelihood they aren't going to win anything. That stuff goes to one of four teams. So if you exist to make up the numbers, what's the point? We're not going to get a violent game back, the sport as a whole has changed. I doubt many players want to be in an overly physical league. Personally I think only artificial leveling - wage cap - which will upset Iggy enormously, is the only way to produce a league that keeps everyone interested. Having a league full of teams “challenging” for a trophy is not realistic and also, I don’t believe, the problem. Pre NIC we were competitive every night but we were very rarely ever serious challengers and yet our barn was full. The EIHL need to focus on retaining the mid level teams like Fife, Coventry and Manchester and preferably adding to them. These are the teams that create a competitive yet varied (in terms of numbers) league. The problem we had in the early EIHL days was a massive gap in standard between the arena and non-arena teams. These middle of the road teams bridge that gap and really are the future for the EIHL. The chances of getting another three or four arena teams is none to zero, yet mini arenas of 3000 ish are sustainable and should be the focus. I don’t see the proposed new second tier being a threat to the EIHL. The standard is going to be lower than the old EPL and once again they’re making the mistake of excluding any organisation north of Hull.
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Post by The Flying Shirt on Mar 16, 2019 12:14:28 GMT
I think the bigger problem for a lot of fanbases is that they know they'll not challenge for anything. They might make the playoff quarterfinals, they might make a Challenge Cup semifinal (Guildford says "Oi!" at this point), but in all likelihood they aren't going to win anything. That stuff goes to one of four teams. So if you exist to make up the numbers, what's the point? We're not going to get a violent game back, the sport as a whole has changed. I doubt many players want to be in an overly physical league. Personally I think only artificial leveling - wage cap - which will upset Iggy enormously, is the only way to produce a league that keeps everyone interested. Having a league full of teams “challenging” for a trophy is not realistic and also, I don’t believe, the problem. Pre NIC we were competitive every night but we were very rarely ever serious challengers and yet our barn was full. The EIHL need to focus on retaining the mid level teams like Fife, Coventry and Manchester and preferably adding to them. These are the teams that create a competitive yet varied (in terms of numbers) league. The problem we had in the early EIHL days was a massive gap in standard between the arena and non-arena teams. These middle of the road teams bridge that gap and really are the future for the EIHL. The chances of getting another three or four arena teams is none to zero, yet mini arenas of 3000 ish are sustainable and should be the focus. I don’t see the proposed new second tier being a threat to the EIHL. The standard is going to be lower than the old EPL and once again they’re making the mistake of excluding any organisation north of Hull. It's not about standards. It's about cost.
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Post by NickThePanther44 on Mar 16, 2019 12:44:41 GMT
Having a league full of teams “challenging” for a trophy is not realistic and also, I don’t believe, the problem. Pre NIC we were competitive every night but we were very rarely ever serious challengers and yet our barn was full. The EIHL need to focus on retaining the mid level teams like Fife, Coventry and Manchester and preferably adding to them. These are the teams that create a competitive yet varied (in terms of numbers) league. The problem we had in the early EIHL days was a massive gap in standard between the arena and non-arena teams. These middle of the road teams bridge that gap and really are the future for the EIHL. The chances of getting another three or four arena teams is none to zero, yet mini arenas of 3000 ish are sustainable and should be the focus. I don’t see the proposed new second tier being a threat to the EIHL. The standard is going to be lower than the old EPL and once again they’re making the mistake of excluding any organisation north of Hull. It's not about standards. It's about cost. Of course. That doesn’t mean the only option is opting out of the league though. Dropping to a two or three import league may well cut costs but it’s also very likely to decimate income which certainly won’t help.
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Shaggy
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Post by Shaggy on Mar 16, 2019 15:05:33 GMT
I don’t see the proposed new second tier being a threat to the EIHL. The standard is going to be lower than the old EPL and once again they’re making the mistake of excluding any organisation north of Hull. Unfortunately, you appear to be wrong on 2 fronts:- - MK are dropping down, so that's cost us a team. - Leeds are joining this new NIHL division, and that's further north than Hull.
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Post by NickThePanther44 on Mar 16, 2019 15:17:01 GMT
I don’t see the proposed new second tier being a threat to the EIHL. The standard is going to be lower than the old EPL and once again they’re making the mistake of excluding any organisation north of Hull. Unfortunately, you appear to be wrong on 2 fronts:- - MK are dropping down, so that's cost us a team. - Leeds are joining this new NIHL division, and that's further north than Hull. Busted.
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Shaggy
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Post by Shaggy on Mar 16, 2019 15:17:50 GMT
Unfortunately, you appear to be wrong on 2 fronts:- - MK are dropping down, so that's cost us a team. - Leeds are joining this new NIHL division, and that's further north than Hull. Busted. I wish you'd been right...
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Post by NickThePanther44 on Mar 16, 2019 15:23:52 GMT
I wish you'd been right... Me too. MK have the potential to be very competitive in the EIHL with their rink and decent sized fanbase. Damn shame.
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Post by The Flying Shirt on Mar 16, 2019 16:24:42 GMT
I don’t see the proposed new second tier being a threat to the EIHL. The standard is going to be lower than the old EPL and once again they’re making the mistake of excluding any organisation north of Hull. Unfortunately, you appear to be wrong on 2 fronts:- - MK are dropping down, so that's cost us a team. - Leeds are joining this new NIHL division, and that's further north than Hull. Scotland is further north too. If the very very strong rumor's are right.
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