BigLad
David Clarke
TWITTER: @AntMJ11
Posts: 3,585
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Post by BigLad on Jan 23, 2019 14:56:10 GMT
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Post by PantherB on Jan 23, 2019 15:14:34 GMT
Enjoyed that. Really don't understand why we don't hear more from him over the season. Maybe a start of season interview, mid season and post-season interview.
He talks a lot of sense and gives explanations, exactly what I've been wanting to hear.
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nottinghamsenator
Robert Lachowicz
How much wood could a Tkachuk chuck if a Tkachuk could chuck wood?
Posts: 424
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Post by nottinghamsenator on Jan 23, 2019 15:19:19 GMT
Sounds like Strachan has a real chance of getting the gig if he wins a trophy based on that, not sure how I feel about that. He put great emphasis on the Challenge Cup rather than Play-Offs because of the European connotations, so I would wager that could potentially be the deal breaker. "Doing no worse than 60%" isn't really an intensive league goal if I'm honest.
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,422
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Post by iginla on Jan 23, 2019 15:25:37 GMT
Yep reasonable interview and about time we heard more from him. Twice he said “we want to finish 3rd at worst,or win the challenge cup or play offs”.......Mmmm just on the off chance we might somehow sneak into Europe next year ! 🤣😆
“Totally committed and doing their absolute best” ? I don’t think so,if they were doing that we would spend the extra money we could easily afford on a far superior team. Depth is fine,however you could have 40 players but if not enough of them are quality difference makers then you ain’t winning anything !
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Post by pantherlee on Jan 23, 2019 17:28:58 GMT
Yep reasonable interview and about time we heard more from him. Twice he said “we want to finish 3rd at worst,or win the challenge cup or play offs”.......Mmmm just on the off chance we might somehow sneak into Europe next year ! 🤣😆 “Totally committed and doing their absolute best” ? I don’t think so,if they were doing that we would spend the extra money we could easily afford on a far superior team. Depth is fine,however you could have 40 players but if not enough of them are quality difference makers then you ain’t winning anything ! Why does everything have to be so cynical? You say finishing 3rd at worst and winning a trophy from this position and qualifying for europe is a bad thing. You also keep repeatedly saying spending more and more and more money to get a superior team but that's just a bit too simple. I look at this years team and don't think he's holding back the cash. Players with CV's like Rheault, Hurtubise, Olsen, Hughes, Stewart won't be cheap. It will also have been Chernomaz that has identified these players. The problem is the big players we have have massively underperformed (I expected Hurtubise to be among the leagues top scorers) and we still look like a team of complete strangers whereas Cardiff are a cohesive unit. You just have to look at a team like Manchester Utd where just throwing money at it doesn't necessarily solve the problem. You also need the right people in place too. Cardiff and Belfast have the right people at the moment and we and Sheffield don't. Thats the deciding factor for me at the moment.
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Post by The Flying Shirt on Jan 23, 2019 17:34:31 GMT
Yep reasonable interview and about time we heard more from him. Twice he said “we want to finish 3rd at worst,or win the challenge cup or play offs”.......Mmmm just on the off chance we might somehow sneak into Europe next year ! 🤣😆 “Totally committed and doing their absolute best” ? I don’t think so,if they were doing that we would spend the extra money we could easily afford on a far superior team. Depth is fine,however you could have 40 players but if not enough of them are quality difference makers then you ain’t winning anything ! Why does everything have to be so cynical? You say finishing 3rd at worst and winning a trophy from this position and qualifying for europe is a bad thing. You also keep repeatedly saying spending more and more and more money to get a superior team but that's just a bit too simple. I look at this years team and don't think he's holding back the cash. Players with CV's like Rheault, Hurtubise, Olsen, Hughes, Stewart won't be cheap. It will also have been Chernomaz that has identified these players. The problem is the big players we have have massively underperformed (I expected Hurtubise to be among the leagues top scorers) and we still look like a team of complete strangers whereas Cardiff are a cohesive unit. You just have to look at a team like Manchester Utd where just throwing money at it doesn't necessarily solve the problem. You also need the right people in place too. Cardiff and Belfast have the right people at the moment and we and Sheffield don't. Thats the deciding factor for me at the moment. Yhis years problem was Chernomaz, the team he signed and very poor coaching. To an outsider Sheffields problem looks to be a severe lack of money from the outset and it doesn't look to have got any better.
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Post by pantherlee on Jan 23, 2019 17:48:14 GMT
So where has the money gone at Sheffield then? Are/were their attendances suffering?
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Post by bobness on Jan 23, 2019 18:02:30 GMT
Yep reasonable interview and about time we heard more from him. Twice he said “we want to finish 3rd at worst,or win the challenge cup or play offs”.......Mmmm just on the off chance we might somehow sneak into Europe next year ! 🤣😆 “Totally committed and doing their absolute best” ? I don’t think so,if they were doing that we would spend the extra money we could easily afford on a far superior team. Depth is fine,however you could have 40 players but if not enough of them are quality difference makers then you ain’t winning anything ! Why does everything have to be so cynical? You say finishing 3rd at worst and winning a trophy from this position and qualifying for europe is a bad thing. You also keep repeatedly saying spending more and more and more money to get a superior team but that's just a bit too simple. I look at this years team and don't think he's holding back the cash. Players with CV's like Rheault, Hurtubise, Olsen, Hughes, Stewart won't be cheap. It will also have been Chernomaz that has identified these players. The problem is the big players we have have massively underperformed (I expected Hurtubise to be among the leagues top scorers) and we still look like a team of complete strangers whereas Cardiff are a cohesive unit. You just have to look at a team like Manchester Utd where just throwing money at it doesn't necessarily solve the problem. You also need the right people in place too. Cardiff and Belfast have the right people at the moment and we and Sheffield don't. Thats the deciding factor for me at the moment. Broadly this. The problem this season has been players not living up to CVs, or just not really being "good enough", whether that be motivation, effort or coaching. I'd possibly take exception to the Hurtubise point, he's been very solid defensively all year (+12 to date) although his points may have been expected to be a bit more, he is for me, Panthers most complete player of the season. He's had one streak of 5 games without a point, but other than that has never gone more than 2. Pither is fast turning into one of the frustrating many. I expected him to be well over a PPG player this season but he's just looking shot for confidence. 2 points in the last 12 games tells a story, even Steve Lee's got more than that.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2019 18:06:08 GMT
Why does everything have to be so cynical? You say finishing 3rd at worst and winning a trophy from this position and qualifying for europe is a bad thing. You also keep repeatedly saying spending more and more and more money to get a superior team but that's just a bit too simple. I look at this years team and don't think he's holding back the cash. Players with CV's like Rheault, Hurtubise, Olsen, Hughes, Stewart won't be cheap. It will also have been Chernomaz that has identified these players. The problem is the big players we have have massively underperformed (I expected Hurtubise to be among the leagues top scorers) and we still look like a team of complete strangers whereas Cardiff are a cohesive unit. You just have to look at a team like Manchester Utd where just throwing money at it doesn't necessarily solve the problem. You also need the right people in place too. Cardiff and Belfast have the right people at the moment and we and Sheffield don't. Thats the deciding factor for me at the moment. Yhis years problem was Chernomaz, the team he signed and very poor coaching. To an outsider Sheffields problem looks to be a severe lack of money from the outset and it doesn't look to have got any better. And if Strachan gets the job full time things will get a hell of a lot worse !! I certainly couldn't subject myself watching a full season of his hockey! It certainly won't be sexy hockey then !
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,422
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Post by iginla on Jan 23, 2019 18:06:50 GMT
So where has the money gone at Sheffield then? Are/were their attendances suffering? You would have to ask Tony Smith that because it’s a mystery. Sheffield’s crowds have risen again this season and on average are now even better than Panthers this year but their starting roster certainly did not look expensive. Steelers average crowd this season is 5805 and Panthers average is 5666. Therefore either Steelers crowds are false boosted by lots of freebies or Tony Smith has taken a leaf out of Mr Blacks profit book and is stacking the profits.
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Post by PantherB on Jan 23, 2019 18:17:04 GMT
So where has the money gone at Sheffield then? Are/were their attendances suffering? You would have to ask Tony Smith that because it’s a mystery. Sheffield’s crowds have risen again this season and on average are now even better than Panthers this year but their starting roster certainly did not look expensive. Steelers average crowd this season is 5805 and Panthers average is 5666. Therefore either Steelers crowds are false boosted by lots of freebies or Tony Smith has taken a leaf out of Mr Blacks profit book and is stacking the profits. I'm sure there was rumours that Sheffield Arena was struggling for money so increased rent by quite a high amount. Then I'm sure there's been repairs or replacements to the ice plant as well. I'd imagine bringing O'Connor back has used up a decent chunk of the budget too.
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Joe
Lorne Smith
Posts: 751
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Post by Joe on Jan 23, 2019 18:23:19 GMT
Yhis years problem was Chernomaz, the team he signed and very poor coaching. To an outsider Sheffields problem looks to be a severe lack of money from the outset and it doesn't look to have got any better. And if Strachan gets the job full time things will get a hell of a lot worse !! I certainly couldn't subject myself watching a full season of his hockey! It certainly won't be sexy hockey then ! that argument doesn’t particularly make sense considering this season is going to have to get a lot better for him to get the job permanently.
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,422
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Post by iginla on Jan 23, 2019 18:24:31 GMT
Yep reasonable interview and about time we heard more from him. Twice he said “we want to finish 3rd at worst,or win the challenge cup or play offs”.......Mmmm just on the off chance we might somehow sneak into Europe next year ! 🤣😆 “Totally committed and doing their absolute best” ? I don’t think so,if they were doing that we would spend the extra money we could easily afford on a far superior team. Depth is fine,however you could have 40 players but if not enough of them are quality difference makers then you ain’t winning anything ! Why does everything have to be so cynical? You say finishing 3rd at worst and winning a trophy from this position and qualifying for europe is a bad thing. You also keep repeatedly saying spending more and more and more money to get a superior team but that's just a bit too simple. I look at this years team and don't think he's holding back the cash. Players with CV's like Rheault, Hurtubise, Olsen, Hughes, Stewart won't be cheap. It will also have been Chernomaz that has identified these players. The problem is the big players we have have massively underperformed (I expected Hurtubise to be among the leagues top scorers) and we still look like a team of complete strangers whereas Cardiff are a cohesive unit. You just have to look at a team like Manchester Utd where just throwing money at it doesn't necessarily solve the problem. You also need the right people in place too. Cardiff and Belfast have the right people at the moment and we and Sheffield don't. Thats the deciding factor for me at the moment. It’s cynical because we’ve seen it before,heard it before and I know probably as well as you do what they’re like. How many times have we heard “this is the most expensive roster ever” or similar,bloody hell if that were true we’d be spending a million £’s a year by now. Neil says we’re doing everything possible when we’re not,we could spend more,a lot more,therefore if we’re not spending as much as we absolutely possibly could then his argument doesn’t stack up. He also says we have more depth than ever,yes maybe we do in number of imports,but if they aren’t good enough imports it doesn’t matter how many you’ve got. And depth wise don’t forget our Brits are depleted,we lost Clarkey this season,where is his replacement ? Neil also even actually tried to sell our 3rd place as being fine,because it was better than the 4th or 5th we’ve been used to recently. Jeez how can that be an argument,this is the biggest club in Britain and he’s pleased because we’re up to 3rd place ! 🙄
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Post by wgray on Jan 23, 2019 18:53:32 GMT
A good interview from Chris Ellis with some tough questions, but I’m sure Neil will have been given the low down beforehand, besides, it is good to hear from him, it’s good to here what his ambitions were for us this season and the reasons why he has decided to make a change.
There’s no doubt Neil his spent a lot on this team, Stewart will be on a fortune, Rheault, Hurtubise, Olsen and Hughes are new comers with vast experience so you would expect them to be on big wages. Perlini and Pither will have received improved deals from last season and both of them are performing worse than last season, not forgetting Garnett who will be on big bucks even with the MBA included. Plus we have and still are carrying a number of spare players.
I would expect us to be paying similar wages as Cardiff and Belfast but the problem is our key players haven’t performed, whereas Cardiff’s and Belfast’s have.
There is good reason to speculate that we have more money available than other teams. It is a business for Neil and I’m sure he knows the best way to grow it is to be successful in the league.
Surely now Neil has to be asking himself why is it that I’m paying more and more money but I’m still seeing the same results in my business? I’m still seeing key players underperforming, I’m still seeing my team fall apart during December, I’ve even changed the head coach of the team, what factors are causing this to repeat itself? I don’t think it’s as simple as blowing all the other teams out of the water and vastly outspending everyone, he has got to make some decisions to have a positive impact on the focus and culture of the club. It’s not easy but something else has to change if we want to even come close to Cardiff as an ice hockey club.
Anyway, it’s nice to hear from you Neil, I’m sure everyone appreciates the insight you have given us.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2019 19:01:31 GMT
And if Strachan gets the job full time things will get a hell of a lot worse !! I certainly couldn't subject myself watching a full season of his hockey! It certainly won't be sexy hockey then ! that argument doesn’t particularly make sense considering this season is going to have to get a lot better for him to get the job permanently. The brand of hockey can still be dull and boring and we could still end up picking up silverware then black says "i ll give Rick a full season"
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Yotes
Forum Admin
Posts: 16,405
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Post by Yotes on Jan 23, 2019 19:08:28 GMT
TBH it's the sort of thing we hear from Blacky, at occasional intervals, normally when things have gone pear shaped. Standard answers, he's always talked a good game.
Fair play to Chris Ellis for getting the interview, but it'd be more interesting to see him pressed on a few different areas. Rich's preferred assistants for example, our mid-Atlantic friends for another.
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Post by The Flying Shirt on Jan 23, 2019 19:22:53 GMT
You would have to ask Tony Smith that because it’s a mystery. Sheffield’s crowds have risen again this season and on average are now even better than Panthers this year but their starting roster certainly did not look expensive. Steelers average crowd this season is 5805 and Panthers average is 5666. Therefore either Steelers crowds are false boosted by lots of freebies or Tony Smith has taken a leaf out of Mr Blacks profit book and is stacking the profits. I'm sure there was rumours that Sheffield Arena was struggling for money so increased rent by quite a high amount. Then I'm sure there's been repairs or replacements to the ice plant as well. I'd imagine bringing O'Connor back has used up a decent chunk of the budget too. The running costs of the Sheffield Arena must be astronomical. It’s a huge old fashioned place that must eat money by the lorry load. That’s one of the reasons that it’s up for sale for redevelopment.
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Post by The Flying Shirt on Jan 23, 2019 19:24:26 GMT
Yhis years problem was Chernomaz, the team he signed and very poor coaching. To an outsider Sheffields problem looks to be a severe lack of money from the outset and it doesn't look to have got any better. And if Strachan gets the job full time things will get a hell of a lot worse !! I certainly couldn't subject myself watching a full season of his hockey! It certainly won't be sexy hockey then ! NB won’t pay two head coaches wages and that’s why Strachan was promoted.
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Post by The Flying Shirt on Jan 23, 2019 19:25:43 GMT
And if Strachan gets the job full time things will get a hell of a lot worse !! I certainly couldn't subject myself watching a full season of his hockey! It certainly won't be sexy hockey then ! that argument doesn’t particularly make sense considering this season is going to have to get a lot better for him to get the job permanently. He won’t get the job. He is the cheaper option at the moment.
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Joe
Lorne Smith
Posts: 751
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Post by Joe on Jan 23, 2019 19:46:33 GMT
that argument doesn’t particularly make sense considering this season is going to have to get a lot better for him to get the job permanently. The brand of hockey can still be dull and boring and we could still end up picking up silverware then black says "i ll give Rick a full season" How often is dull and boring successful though?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2019 19:48:46 GMT
The brand of hockey can still be dull and boring and we could still end up picking up silverware then black says "i ll give Rick a full season" How often is dull and boring successful though? The Matsos years in Sheffield... And yes even though they won league titles the wife tells me it was awful to watch
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,422
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Post by iginla on Jan 23, 2019 19:57:30 GMT
I'm sure there was rumours that Sheffield Arena was struggling for money so increased rent by quite a high amount. Then I'm sure there's been repairs or replacements to the ice plant as well. I'd imagine bringing O'Connor back has used up a decent chunk of the budget too. The running costs of the Sheffield Arena must be astronomical. It’s a huge old fashioned place that must eat money by the lorry load. That’s one of the reasons that it’s up for sale for redevelopment. That shouldn’t be Steelers cost though,apart from maybe some ice stuff,the Steelers are just a tenant in the arena. If you rent a house and the boiler breaks down you don’t pay to replace it the landlord does !
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Post by The Flying Shirt on Jan 23, 2019 20:10:33 GMT
The running costs of the Sheffield Arena must be astronomical. It’s a huge old fashioned place that must eat money by the lorry load. That’s one of the reasons that it’s up for sale for redevelopment. That shouldn’t be Steelers cost though,apart from maybe some ice stuff,the Steelers are just a tenant in the arena. If you rent a house and the boiler breaks down you don’t pay to replace it the landlord does ! I don’t think it is Steelers cost. I don’t think the league is as stable as some think and Smith has put his own money into the Steelers for years and perhaps it was time to stop.
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Post by kievthegreat on Jan 23, 2019 21:15:12 GMT
So where has the money gone at Sheffield then? Are/were their attendances suffering? You would have to ask Tony Smith that because it’s a mystery. Sheffield’s crowds have risen again this season and on average are now even better than Panthers this year but their starting roster certainly did not look expensive. Steelers average crowd this season is 5805 and Panthers average is 5666. Therefore either Steelers crowds are false boosted by lots of freebies or Tony Smith has taken a leaf out of Mr Blacks profit book and is stacking the profits. Worth pointing out that Steelers only charge £5 for several midweek games. Could argue they are getting in people they might not have got, but at the same time that 26,000 tickets sold at 75% off. 9252 against MKL 4578 against Flyers 3659 against Stars 4331 against Flyers again 4702 against the Blaze Would less than 4000 fans at £5 have paid the rent for that game?
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iginla
Chick Zamick
Posts: 13,422
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Post by iginla on Jan 23, 2019 21:29:49 GMT
You would have to ask Tony Smith that because it’s a mystery. Sheffield’s crowds have risen again this season and on average are now even better than Panthers this year but their starting roster certainly did not look expensive. Steelers average crowd this season is 5805 and Panthers average is 5666. Therefore either Steelers crowds are false boosted by lots of freebies or Tony Smith has taken a leaf out of Mr Blacks profit book and is stacking the profits. Worth pointing out that Steelers only charge £5 for several midweek games. Could argue they are getting in people they might not have got, but at the same time that 26,000 tickets sold at 75% off. 9252 against MKL 4578 against Flyers 3659 against Stars 4331 against Flyers again 4702 against the Blaze Would less than 4000 fans at £5 have paid the rent for that game? Yes i know Kieran that’s why i mentioned freebies too. The normal ticket price isn’t £20 though is it,because you’ve got kids and concessions to account for. Around £13 is probably a fair average ticket price i would say spread across a normal crowd so at £5 it’s not 75% off. According to Steeltalk their crowd for the Cardiff game tonight is terrible.
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