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Post by james1977 on Apr 9, 2012 20:15:27 GMT
Congrats to you guys but in all fairness having a bye in the semis, not your fault, and then playing a depleted team who played 70 mins against the league champions earlier on, and then playing in your own barn surely anything but a win would have been a no no. Its not the Panthers fans fault one iota, but the sooner we all play on a level playing field the better. You guys have the best facilty its true, but its about time this mickey mouse league forked out for ice at either the MEN or the O2 and made this truelly a neutral venue. At £45 for a ticket for the final that cant be to far fetched as that was the price on Sunday. A bye in the semis? The team that beat the second best team in the league? Back under your bridge troll.
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Post by PantherTom on Apr 9, 2012 20:16:17 GMT
Congrats to you guys but in all fairness having a bye in the semis, not your fault, and then playing a depleted team who played 70 mins against the league champions earlier on, and then playing in your own barn surely anything but a win would have been a no no. Its not the Panthers fans fault one iota, but the sooner we all play on a level playing field the better. You guys have the best facilty its true, but its about time this mickey mouse league forked out for ice at either the MEN or the O2 and made this truelly a neutral venue. At £45 for a ticket for the final that cant be to far fetched as that was the price on Sunday. To play at the o2 or MEN you need at least 18000 fans which we don't have
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Post by cooperphil156 on Apr 9, 2012 20:23:07 GMT
Yeah I agree - O2 is 20,000 capactity and MEN 21,000 - how on earth can that be filled!! Ridiculous suggestion. Possible venues - Not that many alternatives. Cardiff is a non starter with a small ice playing area and seating. Belfast bigger, but transport a real problem regarding cost. Sheffield Motorpoint is a possibility, but I think you will admit out of the city means that attractions such as restaurants etc not handy. After all Steelers could not even get into that for their semi - Hull. The only other arena is Braehead - capactity and travel costs prohibit this. The NIC is after all the National stadium and it took vision to construct it in Nottingham. Not many would complain about a night or two out in Nottingham. There is no ice hockey in London and the O2 arena would take some filling and leave the league going the same way as Manchester Storm etc, with empty seats and a big rental. I think if Panthers had not been in the final this would not have been raised. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "British ice hockey at its best. What a fantastic facility, what a fantastic building and one fitting for the play off final." Quote on Sky from - David Simms, whom I think you will know.
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Shaggy
Forum Moderator
Am I a cynical idealist or an idealistic cynic?
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Post by Shaggy on Apr 9, 2012 20:27:10 GMT
You guys have the best facilty its true, but its about time this mickey mouse league forked out for ice at either the MEN or the O2 and made this truelly a neutral venue. At £45 for a ticket for the final that cant be to far fetched as that was the price on Sunday. How many times does this point have to be made until it actually sinks in? There is no neutral venue that is practical, and very few that are even conceivably possible.The MEN is a complete non-starter... it may have had a proper ice plant in the past, it does not now. When something like Disney On Ice is held there, they bring their own portable ice plant. The cost of which would be so ludicrously high that the EIHL could never afford it - for the MEN or any other location that has no integral equipment (like the Birmingham NEC). The O2 may be physically possible... but utterly unaffordable. Can you imagine the hugely increased cost of hiring the place? Not to mention an increase in so many costs for all concerned? (accomodation being one of the bigger ones). That's even if the place would be available at the right time... take a look at their events list - it's booked up almost continuously by events vastly more profitable to the O2 than we could ever be. Actually, I will amend my highlighted statement slightly. The Metro Radio Arena in Newcastle is marginally possible... it only holds 5500 for ice hockey, a full thousand people fewer than the NIC, but (as far as I know) still has its own integral ice plant. Whether the arena would even want us there is another matter... and whether any hockey person would even want to have anything to do with them after the debacle surrounding the Newcastle Vipers is quite another. Unless anyone has got a 6000-plus (seating for hockey) capacity arena with its own integral ice plant hiding somewhere in their back pocket, the only possible options are the NIC, Belfast or Sheffield. None of which are neutral venues.
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Post by james1977 on Apr 9, 2012 20:28:47 GMT
Capacities at the O2 and MEN are both 17,500 for ice hockey but the point still stands, the EIHL would never fill them and would probably struggle to hit breakeven.
Shaggy - The MRA doesn't have a working ice plant anymore. They tried to squeeze the Vipers to pay for a replacement which is why they moved to Whitley Bay.
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Post by panthersgirl on Apr 9, 2012 20:36:38 GMT
Its sad when fans are so bitter that we won that they complain on the venue. Yes we do have a slight advantage being at our 'home' rink but like everyone says there isnt anywhere else! Feels to me that bitterness has taken over what should be seen as a fantastic achievement for our club.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Apr 9, 2012 21:14:29 GMT
... And expect the same level of bitterness for a while yet as the venue for these championships will remain the same
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Post by anderson1990 on Apr 9, 2012 21:21:51 GMT
You guys have the best facilty its true, but its about time this mickey mouse league forked out for ice at either the MEN or the O2 and made this truelly a neutral venue. At £45 for a ticket for the final that cant be to far fetched as that was the price on Sunday. How many times does this point have to be made until it actually sinks in? There is no neutral venue that is practical, and very few that are even conceivably possible.The MEN is a complete non-starter... it may have had a proper ice plant in the past, it does not now. When something like Disney On Ice is held there, they bring their own portable ice plant. The cost of which would be so ludicrously high that the EIHL could never afford it - for the MEN or any other location that has no integral equipment (like the Birmingham NEC). The O2 may be physically possible... but utterly unaffordable. Can you imagine the hugely increased cost of hiring the place? Not to mention an increase in so many costs for all concerned? (accomodation being one of the bigger ones). That's even if the place would be available at the right time... take a look at their events list - it's booked up almost continuously by events vastly more profitable to the O2 than we could ever be. Actually, I will amend my highlighted statement slightly. The Metro Radio Arena in Newcastle is marginally possible... it only holds 5500 for ice hockey, a full thousand people fewer than the NIC, but (as far as I know) still has its own integral ice plant. Whether the arena would even want us there is another matter... and whether any hockey person would even want to have anything to do with them after the debacle surrounding the Newcastle Vipers is quite another. Unless anyone has got a 6000-plus (seating for hockey) capacity arena with its own integral ice plant hiding somewhere in their back pocket, the only possible options are the NIC, Belfast or Sheffield. None of which are neutral venues. In terms of neutral arenas, the Scottish Hydro Arena is going to be complete in 2013. With a capacity of 12,500. It would be neutral, albeit, Braehead nearby. However, it's close to Glasgow's city centre and loads of hotels. Would be ideal if it is capable of accommodating an ice rink. Which many people seem to think it will. The only problem I guess is whether or not the EIHL could fill the majority of the arena.
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Post by tzenjin on Apr 9, 2012 21:33:07 GMT
Remember guys, whenever your team wins at home it's not a fair win because they have an epic advantage.
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Mark
Randall Weber
Experience has taught me that when it really matters the only person you can rely on is yourself.
Posts: 4,615
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Post by Mark on Apr 9, 2012 21:38:00 GMT
Give it to Belfast for a season. It'd be interesting to see how many fans turned up given it's location.
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5+game
Terry Kurtenbach
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Post by 5+game on Apr 9, 2012 21:38:30 GMT
How many times does this point have to be made until it actually sinks in? There is no neutral venue that is practical, and very few that are even conceivably possible.The MEN is a complete non-starter... it may have had a proper ice plant in the past, it does not now. When something like Disney On Ice is held there, they bring their own portable ice plant. The cost of which would be so ludicrously high that the EIHL could never afford it - for the MEN or any other location that has no integral equipment (like the Birmingham NEC). The O2 may be physically possible... but utterly unaffordable. Can you imagine the hugely increased cost of hiring the place? Not to mention an increase in so many costs for all concerned? (accomodation being one of the bigger ones). That's even if the place would be available at the right time... take a look at their events list - it's booked up almost continuously by events vastly more profitable to the O2 than we could ever be. Actually, I will amend my highlighted statement slightly. The Metro Radio Arena in Newcastle is marginally possible... it only holds 5500 for ice hockey, a full thousand people fewer than the NIC, but (as far as I know) still has its own integral ice plant. Whether the arena would even want us there is another matter... and whether any hockey person would even want to have anything to do with them after the debacle surrounding the Newcastle Vipers is quite another. Unless anyone has got a 6000-plus (seating for hockey) capacity arena with its own integral ice plant hiding somewhere in their back pocket, the only possible options are the NIC, Belfast or Sheffield. None of which are neutral venues. In terms of neutral arenas, the Scottish Hydro Arena is going to be complete in 2013. With a capacity of 12,500. It would be neutral, albeit, Braehead nearby. However, it's close to Glasgow's city centre and loads of hotels. Would be ideal if it is capable of accommodating an ice rink. Which many people seem to think it will. The only problem I guess is whether or not the EIHL could fill the majority of the arena. We couldnt fill the NIC so i doubt we could fill that one, and with it being so far away there are likely to be even less people attending. The NIC is the best option but unfortunately(for other teams that is) it is our home arena
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Post by anderson1990 on Apr 9, 2012 21:58:44 GMT
We couldnt fill the NIC so i doubt we could fill that one, and with it being so far away there are likely to be even less people attending. The NIC is the best option but unfortunately(for other teams that is) it is our home arena Surely Nottingham and Sheffield would still bring a big crowd up? Cardiff brought 300 up to Scotland for a triple header at the turn of the year so they could definitely bring up a reasonable amount. With it being in Scotland the Scottish teams and Belfast could account for a considerable amount of the crowd. That said, I doubt the 3 smaller Scottish teams would bring a significant amount. I've not got anything against it being at the NIC, I think as a venue it is top notch, and for the sort of crowds the playoffs are pulling at the moment its definitely the best place. I think it would be nice if it moved about though, purely because it would give more people the chance to experience it. I couldn't make the playoffs this year because of money, with travel and accommodation etc, I just couldn't afford it at this time. Obviously, if it was up in Glasgow I wouldn't have that problem.
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Shaggy
Forum Moderator
Am I a cynical idealist or an idealistic cynic?
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Post by Shaggy on Apr 9, 2012 22:03:21 GMT
How many times does this point have to be made until it actually sinks in? There is no neutral venue that is practical, and very few that are even conceivably possible.The MEN is a complete non-starter... it may have had a proper ice plant in the past, it does not now. When something like Disney On Ice is held there, they bring their own portable ice plant. The cost of which would be so ludicrously high that the EIHL could never afford it - for the MEN or any other location that has no integral equipment (like the Birmingham NEC). The O2 may be physically possible... but utterly unaffordable. Can you imagine the hugely increased cost of hiring the place? Not to mention an increase in so many costs for all concerned? (accomodation being one of the bigger ones). That's even if the place would be available at the right time... take a look at their events list - it's booked up almost continuously by events vastly more profitable to the O2 than we could ever be. Actually, I will amend my highlighted statement slightly. The Metro Radio Arena in Newcastle is marginally possible... it only holds 5500 for ice hockey, a full thousand people fewer than the NIC, but (as far as I know) still has its own integral ice plant. Whether the arena would even want us there is another matter... and whether any hockey person would even want to have anything to do with them after the debacle surrounding the Newcastle Vipers is quite another. Unless anyone has got a 6000-plus (seating for hockey) capacity arena with its own integral ice plant hiding somewhere in their back pocket, the only possible options are the NIC, Belfast or Sheffield. None of which are neutral venues. In terms of neutral arenas, the Scottish Hydro Arena is going to be complete in 2013. With a capacity of 12,500. It would be neutral, albeit, Braehead nearby. However, it's close to Glasgow's city centre and loads of hotels. Would be ideal if it is capable of accommodating an ice rink. Which many people seem to think it will. The only problem I guess is whether or not the EIHL could fill the majority of the arena. Sounds interesting... but I'd wait until there's definitely an ice plant in there before even thinking about it. Doubt very much we could fill that arena - but could we fill it enough to make it worthwhile for the league? No idea... certainly something to be kept in the back of the mind as an idea (once the current deal with the NIC runs out, of course). Unless it was too highly priced, you could bank on a few thousand Scottish fans, and I would expect it would be nicely do-able for a load of Giants fans via the ferry. The rest of us? We'd have a bit of a trek, which would certainly reduce the numbers somewhat... but hey - we traditionally travel in large numbers, so... who knows? But the ice plant thing is the first and biggest hurdle.
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foxy
Jade Galbraith
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Post by foxy on Apr 10, 2012 7:58:22 GMT
Its sad when fans are so bitter that we won that they complain on the venue. Yes we do have a slight advantage being at our 'home' rink but like everyone says there isnt anywhere else! Feels to me that bitterness has taken over what should be seen as a fantastic achievement for our club. Not bitter in any way. It was a tense and gritty final which we couldn't have played any other way. I agree about the venue but give one valid reason why Nottingham should have the same bench and dressing room every year? This is after all a weekend the EIHL pay for not Nottingham.
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Post by panthersdave on Apr 10, 2012 8:24:36 GMT
Its sad when fans are so bitter that we won that they complain on the venue. Yes we do have a slight advantage being at our 'home' rink but like everyone says there isnt anywhere else! Feels to me that bitterness has taken over what should be seen as a fantastic achievement for our club. Not bitter in any way. It was a tense and gritty final which we couldn't have played any other way. I agree about the venue but give one valid reason why Nottingham should have the same bench and dressing room every year? This is after all a weekend the EIHL pay for not Nottingham. Because Nottingham are tennants of the NIC and therefore hold an awful lot of stuff in the home dressing room, it would be a logistical faff to move it all around. Plus our dressing room is decorated with Panthers colours and has badges all over etc. Would the other teams actually want that? As a result it is them common sense to have the 'home' bench too because of the proximity to the home dressing room. The two dressing rooms are pretty much the same size and everything, as are the benches so I really think this is a lot of fuss and bitterness over nothing, I mean are people seriously suggesting we won because of the bench we used? I hope no hockey coach makes that lame an excuse for losing.
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Shorty
Paul Adey
Still here for Private Messages
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Post by Shorty on Apr 10, 2012 8:37:40 GMT
A bye in the semis? The team that beat the second best team in the league? Back under your bridge troll. It was actually being sung by Panthers fans. Not a lot mind, but still sung. I guess every game that we have lost when we have not had a full bench,and played the night before when the opposition has not, does not really count as a defeat on Wannabee2's basis.
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Post by texpef on Apr 10, 2012 8:50:15 GMT
Lets not forget due to circumstance on Sunday we automatically became the highest seeded team and as far as i know should then automatically get to be the "home" team. I was amazed they announced cardiff as the home team as under no criteria could i see how that was justified?..
I can see the point of home team advantage (more fans etc etc) as i have watched that work to steelers advantage on more numerous occasions as i care to mention but the reality of here and now is that the EIHL have booked the NIC for the next 5 years and as long as Panthers qualify (we dont get a bye contrary to some fans opinion) then they will have whatever that advantage brings. When and if other facilities are brought online and can match what is available then maybe the POFW will be shared around.
Finally a point on the weekend becoming stale and people having a moan that it is panthers fault, The EIHL are the ones who booked the venue and it is up to them how they then decide what entertainment is laid on. Personally i thought it was done on the cheap and constituted very poor value for fans of teams that werent there (hence the bitching from sheffield and coventry no doubt) but i fail to see how that is panthers fault. Yes next year i would like a hockey "village" on the 2nd rink, i would like to see ALOT more stalls selling hockey related items as it was when i went to wembley and yes i would like to see alot more entertainment on the ice be it another game or two (under 21 international, england v scotland, kids anything is better than nothing) but as a fan of the team that won, successful weekend as far as i am concerned...
Next season if panthers arent there then no doubt all the above factors could influence whether i attend or not...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2012 9:10:49 GMT
The amount of bitterness that is around various forums is quite frankly astonishing and would not be there if we had not won.
I am so proud of the team having won 4 out of the last 6 trophies available and the fact it narks off so many opposing fans makes it all the more sweeter if you ask me.
Makes you wonder what sort of conspiracy theories they'll come up with when we finally do win the league!
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5+game
Terry Kurtenbach
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Post by 5+game on Apr 10, 2012 9:23:38 GMT
The amount of bitterness that is around various forums is quite frankly astonishing and would not be there if we had not won. I am so proud of the team having won 4 out of the last 6 trophies available and the fact it narks off so many opposing fans makes it all the more sweeter if you ask me. Makes you wonder what sort of conspiracy theories they'll come up with when we finally do win the league! Amen to that jono. Had we played the Stingrays and Cardiff at a neutral venue would the result have been any different, i very much doubt it. The amount of belfast players moaning about the league not reseeding the teams, meaning they would have played the stingrays is quite laughable. The league have never reseeded teams, but for some reason that is the panthers fault. I would also like to offer my sincere thanks to Stef for his help in us winning the playoffs and hope he collected his winners medal, as alot of fans seem to think having OUR own announcer was a big factor in our win. We are here to win trophies not friends,and i think over the past few season its been mission accomplished. Had the steelers not packed their bags and headed for the golf course a week befor the playoff q/f things may have been different
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Post by panthersdave on Apr 10, 2012 9:27:31 GMT
Lepines hit, discuss. Looked ok to me, Lepine turned and they collided with the guy unlucky enough to hit Leps shoulder.
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Post by PantherTom on Apr 10, 2012 9:45:37 GMT
Lepines hit, discuss. Looked ok to me, Lepine turned and they collided with the guy unlucky enough to hit Leps shoulder. That was a massive hit! No malice just big and clean
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foxy
Jade Galbraith
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Post by foxy on Apr 10, 2012 10:16:45 GMT
Lets not forget due to circumstance on Sunday we automatically became the highest seeded team and as far as i know should then automatically get to be the "home" team. I was amazed they announced cardiff as the home team as under no criteria could i see how that was justified?.. Exactly the same way as you ended up playing Hull in the semi's. When Hull beat Sheffield they took the second seed place or else you would have played us. When we beat Belfast on saturday we took first place seeding hence then becoming home team.
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Post by panthersdave on Apr 10, 2012 10:19:46 GMT
Lets not forget due to circumstance on Sunday we automatically became the highest seeded team and as far as i know should then automatically get to be the "home" team. I was amazed they announced cardiff as the home team as under no criteria could i see how that was justified?.. Exactly the same way as you ended up playing Hull in the semi's. When Hull beat Sheffield they took the second seed place or else you would have played us. When we beat Belfast on saturday we took first place seeding hence then becoming home team. So as the home team Cardiff had the advantage of 2nd line change - we wont let facts like that get in the way of some fans agendas though eh?
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Post by johnbluebeam on Apr 10, 2012 10:34:44 GMT
Lepines hit looked OK to me at the time and still does. Thommo described it as a fair, good open ice hit and Simms agreed. If it was that bad, where was Chris, 357 PIM's, Frank when he was needed? Didn't notice him in either game.
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5+game
Terry Kurtenbach
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Post by 5+game on Apr 10, 2012 10:36:02 GMT
Exactly the same way as you ended up playing Hull in the semi's. When Hull beat Sheffield they took the second seed place or else you would have played us. When we beat Belfast on saturday we took first place seeding hence then becoming home team. So as the home team Cardiff had the advantage of 2nd line change - we wont let facts like that get in the way of some fans agendas though eh? What are you talking about advantage of 2nd line change. we all know the biggest advantage in hockey is having your own announcer and changing room.
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